Paragon Posted June 9, 2003 Report Share Posted June 9, 2003 I'm interested in what people who've used both of the two Hero 5th capable character creators (Metacreator with one of the 5th Templates and Hero Designer) think of the two of them. What are the advantages and disadvantages of the two? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monolith Posted June 9, 2003 Report Share Posted June 9, 2003 The advantage to MetaCreator is that it is quicker. The program loads quicker and does not use anywhere near the same amount of memory as Hero Designer. On my lower memory computers I will actually load MC instead of HD if I need to quickly check something. MC comes up in one or two seconds. Hero designer takes sometimes 10 or 15. The advantage to Hero Designer is that is official and is constantly being updated and correct. I am not saying that Chris is not updating MetaCreator, but he is just a fan and so things only get done if he feels like doing them or has time to do them; MetaCreator is a fan endeavor. Hero Designer is a professional endeavor, and it shows in the amount of support Dan does give to the product. If you have a higher memory computer (512+) I would say go with Hero Designer. If you have a lower memory computer (256-) then your best bet is to go with MC; at least until Dan fixes the memory issues in version 2.0. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEmerged Posted June 9, 2003 Report Share Posted June 9, 2003 One important point: Creator doesn't always do its math accurately -- this is most noticeable when you try to put limitations on compound powers or elemental control slots. So for me, there's no contest. However, take that "slower loading" thing literally: Designer is slower, period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted June 9, 2003 Report Share Posted June 9, 2003 Originally posted by TheEmerged One important point: Creator doesn't always do its math accurately -- this is most noticeable when you try to put limitations on compound powers or elemental control slots. So for me, there's no contest. However, take that "slower loading" thing literally: Designer is slower, period. The only math issue I'm aware of is the whole rounding thing, which has been a bit of a debate in any event, although by all means now HD is compliant with Steve's latest rulings and MC is not on that count. Can you please be more specific, with an example? Anyway, here's some threads in response to the original poster, I highly encourage these - apparently the last time they persuaded somebody to buy it - despite my best efforts! (just kidding, you'll see I have some negative opinions on HD but I do think it is highly useful for a lot, if not most, of HERO followers) http://www.herogames.com/forums/sho...s=&threadid=278 http://www.herogames.com/forums/sho...=&threadid=1383 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackCobra Posted June 9, 2003 Report Share Posted June 9, 2003 Designer, by a long margin. I was never happy with Creator -- it's interface is clunky, it's got some strange holes and it doesn't do print-outs very well (although it has been a while since I've used it). Designer is slow, sure. But the interface is easy to use, and it has lots of print-out options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monolith Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by BlackCobra I was never happy with Creator -- it's interface is clunky, it's got some strange holes and it doesn't do print-outs very well (although it has been a while since I've used it). Designer is slow, sure. But the interface is easy to use, and it has lots of print-out options. You must not have used any version of Creator in years then. The character sheets and combat sheets you can print with MC are several times better than the version you get from HD. Printing is the clunkiest aspect of HD, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Desmarais Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by BlackCobra Designer, by a long margin. I was never happy with Creator -- it's interface is clunky, it's got some strange holes and it doesn't do print-outs very well (although it has been a while since I've used it). What, specifically, do you not like about the MetaCreator print-outs? I've been pretty happy with the character sheet it produces, but sometimes I'm a little to close to it to see all of the problems. John D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by BlackCobra Designer, by a long margin. I was never happy with Creator -- it's interface is clunky, it's got some strange holes and it doesn't do print-outs very well (although it has been a while since I've used it). Designer is slow, sure. But the interface is easy to use, and it has lots of print-out options. I think you're thinking of HeroMaker - ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paragon Posted June 10, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by zornwil T Anyway, here's some threads in response to the original poster, I highly encourage these - apparently the last time they persuaded somebody to buy it - despite my best efforts! (just kidding, you'll see I have some negative opinions on HD but I do think it is highly useful for a lot, if not most, of HERO followers) http://www.herogames.com/forums/sho...s=&threadid=278 http://www.herogames.com/forums/sho...=&threadid=1383 I get "not found on this server" errors on both of these. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herolover Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by Monolith You must not have used any version of Creator in years then. The character sheets and combat sheets you can print with MC are several times better than the version you get from HD. Printing is the clunkiest aspect of HD, IMO. I have to point something out here. Yes, I guess HD's print function is clunky in that there is no point to a print button click and Print. That said, I LOVE HD's print funtion. I print to Word. I then run a quick macro and in seconds I have an output that looks exactly like the output of the books. I can make any character sheet I would ever want down to exact look using Word instead of having to learn a new language by using Creator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monolith Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by Herolover That said, I LOVE HD's print funtion. I print to Word. I then run a quick macro and in seconds I have an output that looks exactly like the output of the books. I agree that if you are a "techie" you can do all kinds of cool things. But if you do not have Word, or do not have enough computer knowledge to write macros, then you are pretty much left with the print function supplied by the program, and it is pretty bad. It has poor spacing and poor page breaks. While I prefer and use Hero Designer, the printing process, the package deal process, and even the ability to print various combat sheets are all much better in MetaCreator, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by Paragon I get "not found on this server" errors on both of these. Sorry, I copied and pasted the text not the links. Here you go...please note they will LOOK the same on the page but the actual underlying URL is in the hyperlink so just click on them... http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=278 http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1383 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Posted June 10, 2003 Report Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by Monolith I agree that if you are a "techie" you can do all kinds of cool things. But if you do not have Word, or do not have enough computer knowledge to write macros, then you are pretty much left with the print function supplied by the program, and it is pretty bad. It has poor spacing and poor page breaks. Er, I feel obligated to point out that the Updates section has an RTF format template which spits out a book-style character sheet without requiring any macros. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paragon Posted June 11, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2003 Originally posted by zornwil Sorry, I copied and pasted the text not the links. Here you go...please note they will LOOK the same on the page but the actual underlying URL is in the hyperlink so just click on them... http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=278 http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1383 Thanks. Those worked. And gave me considerably more food for thought on this subject, though I'm going to let this thread taper off before I make a decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starblaze Posted June 11, 2003 Report Share Posted June 11, 2003 I have used Heromaker, HeroCreator and Hero Designer and of the three I like Hero Creator the best. I was able to make 5th Edition character just by playing with program a little. It is alot faster and more flexible IMO than HD. I am somewhat disappointed with HD's slowless and tendency to freeze up alot. It is very frustrating. Although it is nice program other wise I still preferred Creator. In fact if I had not that someone was going to come out with a 5th edition version of Creator I probably would have never gotten HD. As it is I am using HD because I loaned my Creator disc to another player who then left our group without returning it and I have since then got my new Dell. Oh well maybe 2.0 will be better. And BTW Heromaker wasn't all that bad, if anything it was durable, if only they had fixed that printing problem they had I might have kept using it instead of Creator. I tried using some of the printing solutions on the web but it was just too technical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ndreare Posted June 11, 2003 Report Share Posted June 11, 2003 Never heard of or used Meta Creator were can I gat this at? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zornwil Posted June 11, 2003 Report Share Posted June 11, 2003 http://www.alteregosoftware.com 5th ed. template (free) is at http://www.herogames.com/FreeStuff/Other%20Software/index.htm MUCH RESPECT TO HERO GAMES for putting the MC template on their site - as well as of course to Christopher Mullins for doing all the hard work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted June 11, 2003 Report Share Posted June 11, 2003 Originally posted by zornwil http://www.alteregosoftware.com 5th ed. template (free) is at http://www.herogames.com/FreeStuff/Other%20Software/index.htm MUCH RESPECT TO HERO GAMES for putting the MC template on their site - as well as of course to Christopher Mullins for doing all the hard work. I didn't see any install instructions. Do you just drop it in the creator folder and unzip it? Also - is there a minimum creator version needed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Chaos Posted June 11, 2003 Report Share Posted June 11, 2003 I believe 2.4 is the minimum creator version. and yes just unzip it to the directory. I've encountered some wierd bugs in the creator and will look into them asap instead of pestering Chris about them. If anyone else tracks them down as well post the fixes to the cw list or something. Disadvatages Maximum per Catagory just isn't working correctly. If I use the base I add over 50pts in Disads from any source it gives me the violation error message. If I up the max and then post over 50 in one catagory (i.e. Mental, Physical, or Social) it does the same. The 50 should be from one catagory like Hunted, Psych Lim, etc. I've not had time to look into this yet. If you place characteristics under the powers and leave add to characteristic checked it seems to alter the costs of the secondary characteristics. I tried checking does not add to secondary characteristic and it still seems to change the associated costs. Same if I actually put a seconday characteristic under powers as an add on. I started on this one but haven't had time to work out a way to fix it yet. Kid Chaos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiger Posted June 11, 2003 Report Share Posted June 11, 2003 I prefer HD myself. I have learned to modify it as necessary. Luckly, I will admit, I don't have a large amount of House rules I use. A big plus for me is the HD Packs you can get. They have saved me time and work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ndreare Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 That is funny this whole time I am sitting here thinking I must get this program and when I go to look at it I realize I have had it on my computer for over a year as “Creation Workshop†and “G.U.R.P.S. Character Creatorâ€. I think I will down load the plug in and see if it works for these versions of the program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monolith Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 Originally posted by Ndreare That is funny this whole time I am sitting here thinking I must get this program and when I go to look at it I realize I have had it on my computer for over a year as “Creation Workshop†and “G.U.R.P.S. Character Creatorâ€. I think I will down load the plug in and see if it works for these versions of the program. You need to make sure you have the MetaCreator version. If you just have the Hero Creator or Creation Workshop version it will not work properly for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ndreare Posted June 12, 2003 Report Share Posted June 12, 2003 Alass it seems I will have to buy the metacreator version as it does not work with the versions I have. (But thank you for the directions Monolith) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schir1964 Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 Originally posted by TheEmerged One important point: Creator doesn't always do its math accurately -- this is most noticeable when you try to put limitations on compound powers or elemental control slots. Actually, this is inaccurate. You are probably using a standard sublist entry instead of the "Combined Power" entry. The code was modified so that Combined Power is treated as one thing. Now if there is something else that isn't calculating right, please email and let me know, but so far none of my beta testers have mentioned any calculations problems with the public release. - Christopher Mullins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schir1964 Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 Originally posted by BlackCobra Designer, by a long margin. I was never happy with Creator -- it's interface is clunky, it's got some strange holes and it doesn't do print-outs very well (although it has been a while since I've used it). Designer is slow, sure. But the interface is easy to use, and it has lots of print-out options. I respect your personal preferances. And by the same token, I would fine Hero Designer "Clunky", since it uses tabs instead of windows for displaying Stats/Powers (or so I've been told). That would make the interface difficult for me to use since I would want to see as much as possible side by side as I'm creating character. But again, this is just a personal preference. It doesn't make one better or worse than the other. - Christopher Mullins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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