When GMs Rewrite the rules

[Powerboy]

I'll preface this by saying that we all know GMs can rewrite the rules as they please. These are just a couple of examples of it getting ridiculous.

 

I was in a game where one of the players decided to use mind control on one of the other players. He rolls and succesfully hits. Then the GM and the player with the mind control are acting as if that's it, he's mind controlled. I will mention that this GM was not some rookie, he was a veteran Champions GM. The other player says, "Well, roll your dice to see how many times you get my ego." The GM explains he doesn't have to because they had discussed it and its a 'zero dice attack'. We state that while a MC doesn't do any damage, the dice represent how much you got the person's ego by. The GM explains that he knows that but for an attack that does no damage, he's just up and decided that you just succesfully hit and that's it. To make it even more complex, he explains that only works if you buy it as a zero dice attack. It costs nothing to do that. You just declare that it is. If you decide to buy it as an attack where you have to roll dice to get the ego, that's your option. Then it won't automatically work if you make the initial roll. Why would anyone NOT choose his zero dice attack option? There's NOTHING to be gained by not choosing it and it made powers like MC and Mental Illusions almost invincible.

 

I remember after the game, me and another player were out in the parking lot and we looked a each other and said, "What the h*** was that?"

 

Another example, not of actually breaking the rules but abusing them. He had a tendency to make up villains that all has some 'superior' philosophical outlook. We would sit there and have philosophical debates with them. We might as well. The odds of beating any of his NPCs in a fight were approximately zero, just like his zero attack thing. He loved having NPCs on the team (somebody had to be powerful enough to beat his opponent NPCs if there was ever actually a fight). He had one NPC who he swore was made on less points than the players and who had no defenses. Well, if you don't count the fact that he carried a sword that, instead of being a focus, was a summoned creature. It could project a forcefield in an area and protect its wielder. But the character himself technically had no defenses. Oh and, of course, the one drawback of a summoned creature is that its an NPC. Even if the PC has the advantages to control it, its still played by the GM. When the character who can summon the creature is already an NPC, that drawback is rather meaningless.

 

Needless to say, I didn't stay in that game for too long. Watching paint dry was more exciting.

[Tech]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Veteran GM or not, it sounds like the GM has his idea of how he would use the rules and didn't inform the players of the changes. A real bad mistake. This GM needs to drop the superiority complex of 'Me vs the players' and realize that the players are as important to the game as he is, somewhat similar to an umpire in a baseball game.

 

I'm a veteran GM and the idea of making a change in the rules that the players aren't aware of is ludricrous. If I do decide to try a new ruling, I ask the players ahead of time what they think and if we could try the new rule on the new episode.

[Peregrine]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

When a GM creates house rules (as in your first example), it is that GM's responsibility to communicate those rules to the players out of game so that the players know what to expect and can agree to have that person GM for them with the house rules in effect. Springing them on the players in play is poor GMing.

 

The second example, of "unbeatable" villains and "better than the PCs" NPCs/GMPCs is pure bad GMing. (It is also bad game design when the publishers make NPCs that exceed what the game system allows PCs to be, but that's a tangential rant.) The philosophical debates are simply an annoyance at that point.

 

In the extreme, these (especially the latter) are "flip the table" offenses; your departure from the gaming group was a good, moderate response to a bad GM. (Yes, even veteran GMs can be bad GMs.)

[OddHat]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Sounds like a crappy GM.

 

"Zero Dice Effect" might have been him trying to describe a Standard Effect attack (all dice are considered to roll 3), or it could have been pure BS. At any rate, by the rules he was still obligated to tell the player just how far under he was, and to allow breakout rolls accordingly. If he house ruled that away as well, Mind Control becomes grossly unbalanced.

 

Super NPCs tougher than the players are usually a bad idea, and telling the players "he's built on fewer points than you" means nothing.

 

Sounds young, and not like a GM I'd put up with.

 

As to tweaking the rules and adding house rules, sometimes it makes things easier; it should never be an excuse for screwing the players.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

I'll preface this by saying that we all know GMs can rewrite the rules as they please. These are just a couple of examples of it getting ridiculous.

 

I was in a game where one of the players decided to use mind control on one of the other players. He rolls and succesfully hits. Then the GM and the player with the mind control are acting as if that's it, he's mind controlled. I will mention that this GM was not some rookie, he was a veteran Champions GM. The other player says, "Well, roll your dice to see how many times you get my ego." The GM explains he doesn't have to because they had discussed it and its a 'zero dice attack'. We state that while a MC doesn't do any damage, the dice represent how much you got the person's ego by. The GM explains that he knows that but for an attack that does no damage, he's just up and decided that you just succesfully hit and that's it. To make it even more complex, he explains that only works if you buy it as a zero dice attack. It costs nothing to do that. You just declare that it is. If you decide to buy it as an attack where you have to roll dice to get the ego, that's your option. Then it won't automatically work if you make the initial roll. Why would anyone NOT choose his zero dice attack option? There's NOTHING to be gained by not choosing it and it made powers like MC and Mental Illusions almost invincible.

 

I guess I know what to add next time I spend some XP...since it costs 0, may as well make it AoE, Megascale and affect everyone on the planet. This also means you hit as long as you can DCV 3, since hitting the hex is good enough (and isn't an adjacent hex DCV 0?).

 

Another example' date=' not of actually breaking the rules but abusing them. He had a tendency to make up villains that all has some 'superior' philosophical outlook. We would sit there and have philosophical debates with them. We might as well. The odds of beating any of his NPCs in a fight were approximately zero, just like his zero attack thing. He loved having NPCs on the team (somebody had to be powerful enough to beat his opponent NPCs if there was ever actually a fight). He had one NPC who he swore was made on less points than the players and who had no defenses. Well, if you don't count the fact that he carried a sword that, instead of being a focus, was a summoned creature. It could project a forcefield in an area and protect its wielder. But the character himself technically had no defenses. Oh and, of course, the one drawback of a summoned creature is that its an NPC. Even if the PC has the advantages to control it, its still played by the GM. When the character who can summon the creature is already an NPC, that drawback is rather meaningless.[/quote']

 

So use your 0 point Mind Control on them. Use it through a 0 point Mind Scan so you don't have to be on the same planet.

[Vondy]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

House rules need to be stated before play begins. In an established group there should be some level of consensus on them as well.

[JmOz]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

I have MANY house rules, most of them are small inconsiquential things, that I will inform the players when the power is chosen, large sweeping rules I announce ahead of times

 

an example, range (and more importantly AE radiuses and explosions) are based on the base power, not the active points, it has not been a big deal in any game yet

[Captain Obvious]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Next time you play with that guy, buy a base level Entangle and Drain. Neither one does damage, and you can hit with a 1d6 Drain on all Mental Powers (effectively neutering his uber mentalist), and then use 1d6 Entangle to trap him forever and ever.

[pinecone]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Yeah sounds like a "squint quizically, then leave" circumstance...years ago it would be right then and there, nowadays I'd wait till the end of the run, then bail, as nicely as I could....

[Comic]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Ah.

 

The 'point and laugh' response comes to mind.

[input.jack]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

"Veteran GM" my shiny heinie.

 

As my Dad used to say, "Theres a big difference between ten years' experience, and one years' experience ten times".

[AdamLeisemann]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Sounds like this guy was just bloody awful...

 

Announce rules-changes first. Heck, warn players of any rules-changes, even changes based on style. For instance, if you, the GM, aren't worried about range or distance, then let the players know that so they don't worry about it.

 

And if your players feel it makes a power unbalanced, think about why it's imbalanced and work it around to a concensus.

 

But then, I'm just repeating what everybody else said.

[Powerboy]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

I guess I know what to add next time I spend some XP...since it costs 0, may as well make it AoE, Megascale and affect everyone on the planet. This also means you hit as long as you can DCV 3, since hitting the hex is good enough (and isn't an adjacent hex DCV 0?).

 

 

 

So use your 0 point Mind Control on them. Use it through a 0 point Mind Scan so you don't have to be on the same planet.

 

And the sad part is that as long as the advantages and limitations equaled out to zero, he was allowing stuff like that.

[Powerboy]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Yeah sounds like a "squint quizically' date=' then leave" circumstance...years ago it would be right then and there, nowadays I'd wait till the end of the run, then bail, as nicely as I could....[/quote']

 

I just made an excuse that I was getting too busy to be able to make the game. I only see the guy once a year now at a sci fi con we both attend. We talk for a minute. If his games come up, I'm still too busy.

[Powerboy]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

"Veteran GM" my shiny heinie.

 

As my Dad used to say, "Theres a big difference between ten years' experience, and one years' experience ten times".

 

There's a player I used to know that was often criticised for his bad and out of character playing. His argument was that he had been roleplaying for longer than any of us. Another guy I knew would wait until he was gone and then exclaim, 'No. He's been rolling dice longer than any of us. He never roleplayed."

[ParagonAlpha]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

There's a player I used to know that was often criticised for his bad and out of character playing. His argument was that he had been roleplaying for longer than any of us. Another guy I knew would wait until he was gone and then exclaim' date=' 'No. He's been rolling dice longer than any of us. He never roleplayed."[/quote']

 

 

Gamers tell you what their character can do. Roleplayers tell you what their character did.

[lemming]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Ew. Yea, I might forget a house rule because I've played it for so long, but let's just be a bit reasonable.

 

And nothing against power gaming, but you got to let everyone else play as well then.

[CourtFool]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

You got mind controlled. Deal with it. And all NPCs should be far more powerful than any of the PCs to remind them whose story it is. Damn uppity players.

 

 

 

 

 

Before you get all defensive and reply, I am being a sarcastic twit. Yes, your GM sucked. I am so glad we have validated your feelings. Please post this in one of the numerous 'Bad GM' threads.

[TheRealVector]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

The Hero system rulebook is an awesome value.

 

In addition to containing one of the best roleplaying systems it is also heavy and sturdy enough to be used as a bludgeon against bad GMs.

[CourtFool]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

Yes, but do to its awkward shape, it is not considered a club and requires Weapon Familiarity.

[Powerboy]

Re: When GMs Rewrite the rules

 

You got mind controlled. Deal with it. And all NPCs should be far more powerful than any of the PCs to remind them whose story it is. Damn uppity players.

 

 

 

 

 

Before you get all defensive and reply, I am being a sarcastic twit. Yes, your GM sucked. I am so glad we have validated your feelings. Please post this in one of the numerous 'Bad GM' threads.

 

The sarcasm was rather obvious. But I must reply for it was not I who got mind controlled. Lucky me. But yes, you have validated my feelings about games that are for the NPCs alone (ie. for the GM alone).