Zane_Marlowe Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Hi Friends, It's time I come clean: I'm editing the forthcoming volume in the Pop Culture and Philosophy series, Supervillains and Philosophy. I'm really excited about the stuff in the book, and I can't wait to see what you guys--my fellow Herophiles--think of it. I can tell you at present that it's going to include stuff on several of our favorite bad guys, and, like Tom Morris's 2005 volume on Superheroes, we're going to have a pair of industry contributors involved as well. So, not that it'll impact what goes into the book in any way, but who are your favorite supervillains, without which no book of this kind would be complete? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Subtitle Suggestions Supervillains and Philosophy: Because Good Is Dumb ~Gabriel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Split Decision Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Subtitle Suggestions Supervillains and Philosophy: Why You Just Don't Get Us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Subtitle Suggestions Supervillains and Philosophy: The categorical imperative of power Must haves: Darkseid (DC) Galactus (Marvel) - is he really evil? or is he more like a force of nature? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Typist Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Subtitle Suggestions And how many heroes seem a lot like villains if you consider certain things... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zane_Marlowe Posted February 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Subtitle Suggestions Okay, now I've got to come clean on the thread title. I'm still working on the subtitle for the book, but my wife wisely pointed out that if I open a thread for suggestions, I might similarly open myself or the publisher to legal risk in case we used one of the suggestions. So I edited the text, but I don't think I can change the thread title or "Question" label. That said, I'm still happy to let you know the book is forthcoming, and I'm still interested to know who you think the paradigm cases are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan D. Hurricanes Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Subtitle Suggestions This is awesome! I'm reading "Batman & Philosophy" right now and I'm really enjoying it. It's a great mix of casual writing style and actual philosophical treatise. I'm sure you're going to be hitting most of the 'must-haves' that immediately come to mind (the Joker, The Riddler, Two Face, Lex Luthor, Dr. Doom, Thanos, The Red Skull, etc.) but a less obvious contender I would like to see is Bizarro. (BTW, I can edit the thread title if you need, just lemme know) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Misinterpreted, hey? Now what about Trigon? Kingpin? The Punisher? The Hulk? Loki? Monarch? Parallax? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoreBrute Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Something you have to put into your philosophy is some of the characters from Wanted, if just mentioning the whole thing nonchalantly. Also Dr Doom. Con Wants to rule the world. Pro He would actually be good at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancer Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy So' date=' not that it'll impact what goes into the book in any way, but who are your favorite supervillains, without which no book of this kind would be complete?[/quote'] My regular comic-reading days are decades past, back in the Silver Age. That said, prototypical supervillains from that era include Dr. Doom, Lex Luthor, Galactus, Dormammu, and the suite of classical Batman foes (Penguin, Joker, Riddler, Catwoman), though Batman's enemies seemed to be less megalomaniacal than those others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermit Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Subtitle Suggestions Okay, now I've got to come clean on the thread title. I'm still working on the subtitle for the book, but my wife wisely pointed out that if I open a thread for suggestions, I might similarly open myself or the publisher to legal risk in case we used one of the suggestions. So I edited the text, but I don't think I can change the thread title or "Question" label. That said, I'm still happy to let you know the book is forthcoming, and I'm still interested to know who you think the paradigm cases are. Using my amazing moderator powers *cape flutters* I've taken the question header off this for you. I hope that's what you wanted. And I agree with others, some of the classics are musts. Lex Luthor's raw envy of Superman has been well explored in the past, and the rationalizations he's used to defend his evil are fascinating. I see strong similarities between some takes on him and Syndrome of the Incredibles movie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Typist Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy See, I´m not sure if I buy Lex as Evil. I almost root for the guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnia Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy See, I´m not sure if I buy Lex as Evil. I almost root for the guy. Hell, my husband DOES root for the guy. Common self-made man worried about allowing too much power in the hands of a near-god equivalent (who we only have his word that he'll acquiesce to the proper legal and government authorities). Like it or not, that speaks to a LOT of real life people... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancer Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Well, that's part of what makes him interesting, and why he should be in the book. Whether he's evil is an interesting question. There's no question, however, that he is the villain in the Superman stories. Villains do not have to be evil. The most interesting stories -- the tragedies -- are good against good. Good versus evil often just breaks down into shallow melodrama. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heckus Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Look to the classic archetypes: -the greedy b*st*rd (90% of your garden variety bank robbing villains just want money) -The complete lunatic (Joker) -the thrill seeker (Riddler; He sets up eloborate puzzles to match wits with an opponent...and make a little cash on the side) -the nihilist (Darksied; "Once I secure the secrets of the anti-life equation I will destroy the universe"...and yet he has loyal followers) -the revenge obsessed (Baron Zemo; "[society/hero/whatever] is gonna pay for what they did to me.") -the deluded savior (Magneto; "when I'm in control, everything will be as it should be") -the inhuman monster (Chemo; usually powered by a mix of rage, hunger and confusion.) -the mercenary (Only does it if he's getting paid). -the bored rich guy (Kraven the Hunter) -the megalomaniac (Dr. Doom, Red Skull, Lex Luthor; "when I'm in control, everything will run MY way") -the under-appreciated genius (Dr. Octopus) -the reluctant villain (Sandman [movie version]; he doesn't want to do bad things but for some reason he thinks he has no choice. If life had gone differently he might have been a hero) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zane_Marlowe Posted February 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Hermit, thanks for amending the header, this is perfect. Yes, we've got something on Luthor and the Red Skull, and a lot more on Doom and Magneto relatively speaking. Joker, Watchmen, and some industry contributors: John Ostrander on the Suicide Squad and Denny O'Neil on Two-Face. I'm currently trying to pull off something amazing on the cover with a legendary artist, but I can't say more about that yet. My gamer streak actually arranged a section of the book addressed to the readers themselves: "So You Want to be a Supervillain." Those essays are largely written in second-person, and they offer advice on the dos and don'ts. Galactus, not so much. Two reasons. First, there's a whole essay on him in the 2005 book on Superheroes and Philosophy, and second, the point of that essay applies here perhaps as well, he's not a supervillain so much as a force of nature. He's no more a villain than a landslide, even if he's as inexorable and as cataclysmic. Oh yeah, and nobody submitted an essay on him either. As far as Wanted is concerned, I'm writing that essay now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Main Man Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Man, I haven't read one of these books in a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy I'd like to see something on Dr. Sivana. First, he's the prototype for Lex Luthor (most people aren't aware that Lex Luthor's character changed to mimic Sivana's during the years in which Captain Marvel was outselling Superman), and second the fight between Sivana and Captain Marvel is the original comic-book struggle between science and magic. ~Gabriel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy .oO(Hmmmm) wonders if the old BA in Philosophy is too rusty to read these sorts of essays again... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidume Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy If you are looking at villians that have had an impact I think Black Manta deserves a mention. While Aquaman might not be as much of a pop culture icon as he was when he had his own show, what happen with Manta is a good example of how a villian makes an impact on a hero, or even on a genre. Black Manta's murder of Aquman's infant son redefined the entire Aquaman character, and was one of the first nails in the coffin of the Silver Age of comics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enforcer84 Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy Hell' date=' my husband DOES root for the guy. Common self-made man worried about allowing too much power in the hands of a near-god equivalent (who we only have his word that he'll acquiesce to the proper legal and government authorities). Like it or not, that speaks to a LOT of real life people...[/quote'] So when Lex has all the power does he act benevolently with it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy So is Iron Man in the book? *cough cough Civil War cough* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zane_Marlowe Posted February 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy So is Iron Man in the book? *cough cough Civil War cough* One of my favorite essays is on "Marvel's Recent Unpleasantness," though I worry that that euphamism may be lost on most of us Yankees. You know, most everyone thinks about Stark, and yeah, he was the mover and shaker, but Reed gave the whole thing a heck of a push too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnia Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Re: Supervillains and Philosophy So when Lex has all the power does he act benevolently with it? Well, my husband IS a member of the Vast Hardcore Right Wing Conspiracy, so he's got that mindset to view things through. :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan D. Hurricanes Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 *puts Hermit on The List* Hermit' date=' thanks for amending the header, this is perfect.[/quote'] Hey I edited the title! No respect. No respect I tell you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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