Michael Hopcroft Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 One thing I've been wondering is how a sword beign sharper than a normal sword affects the damage it does? Particularly if the sword gets sharper all the time as it is affected by the magic that makes it extra-sharp? In hsort, is there a real upper limit to the DC even a magic sword can have? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 Re: How does sharpness affect a sword? Originally posted by Michael Hopcroft One thing I've been wondering is how a sword beign sharper than a normal sword affects the damage it does? Particularly if the sword gets sharper all the time as it is affected by the magic that makes it extra-sharp? In hsort, is there a real upper limit to the DC even a magic sword can have? It depends on the armor you expect to encounter. Japanese swords were known to be very sharp because they frequently expected to face foes who were unarmored, or wearing lighter armors than the heavy european plate. Broadswords tended to be fairly dull (relatively speaking) because hitting hard armor with a finely sharpened edge could ruin the blade. An razor edge does increase cutting power against unarmored targets (depth of wound), but it also opens the blade to potential damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemming Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 Re: Re: How does sharpness affect a sword? Originally posted by D-Man It depends on the armor you expect to encounter. Japanese swords were known to be very sharp because they frequently expected to face foes who were unarmored, or wearing lighter armors than the heavy european plate. Broadswords tended to be fairly dull (relatively speaking) because hitting hard armor with a finely sharpened edge could ruin the blade. An razor edge does increase cutting power against unarmored targets (depth of wound), but it also opens the blade to potential damage. If you have magic on a blade that protects it from being damaged even when very sharp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hopcroft Posted January 7, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 Re: Re: Re: How does sharpness affect a sword? Originally posted by lemming If you have magic on a blade that protects it from being damaged even when very sharp. The magic on this particular blade from fiction amde it so sharp that a dulling spell had tgo be cast on it just so it could be scabbarded. otherwise, it was so sharp it would ahve cut right through any sheath you tried to carry it in.] Apparently this is an artifact-class weapon.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Goodwin Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 Re: Re: Re: Re: How does sharpness affect a sword? Originally posted by Michael Hopcroft The magic on this particular blade from fiction amde it so sharp that a dulling spell had tgo be cast on it just so it could be scabbarded. otherwise, it was so sharp it would ahve cut right through any sheath you tried to carry it in.] Apparently this is an artifact-class weapon.... That sounds like it would be an NND Does Body, pick the defense that is reasonable (include "dulling spell" as a possible defense). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BNakagawa Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 Depending on the shape of the blade you could make a scabbard that held the blade from the sides where it isn't sharp. Assuming the sides of the blades don't cut, you wouldn't need a magic spell to sheathe a blade like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markdoc Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 Hey Bryce, we're talking about an item from the Slayers OVA: common sense is not an option. As to the item itself, although it was supposed to cut through anything, often it didn't, so you could probbaly just treat it as a whacking big HKA, (say 6d6) with the -1/2 limitation on the first 4 d6 "Only to neutralise non-magical DEF". That way it would cut stone and steel as easily as flesh, but still only do sword damage - pretty nasty sword damage, it's true, but you would make a sword sized hole rather than blowing things into flinders when you hit them. Cheers, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiger Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 peircing could work as well..or have a extra sharp sword do a littel more damage than normal, so +1 dc or something along these lines.. really totally up to how you want the sword to work in relation ship to other weapons in you campaign Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 As for how to build "mytic sharpness" most people would purchase it as Armor Piercing. If you want to go all out you might purchase it as AVLD, DOES BODY and then define the defense as "force field, force wall, magical hardening" - which makes for an extremely lethal WEAPONG OF POWER. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZootSoot Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 In the real world sharpness depends upon hardness. A very sharp blade is, of necessity a brittle blade, while a flexible, durable blade cannot hold the same sort of edge. Infinitely sharp can best be represented by an extremely large KA AVLD (20 dice maybe, maybe more). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Obvious Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 Re: How does sharpness affect a sword? In game terms, I've most often seen sharp swords written as having a higher number of dice for damage, but a reduced STUN multiplier, to represent how easy it is to cut the hell out of someone with a sharp blade, and they not really feel it. Of course, this is for a more normal type sharpness rather than a magical uber-sharpness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 In my game, weapons enchanted for sharpness don't get a higher damage class, but a bonus to their minimum damage. I run it the same as using CSLs to raise the minimum damage. In general it works out better than just raising the DC, yet it cuts down on obscenely high-damage lucky shots. -AA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest joen00b Posted January 9, 2004 Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 There have been countless debates about the European Knight Vs. The Japanese Samurai. The truth about these were the Japanese built weapons to defeat the Armor, and the Europeans built armor to defeat the weapon. When speaking of sharpness, you have to understand which culture your speaking of. If Japanese Culture, then yes, the sharpness of the blade has a huge impact on the weapon, and in terms could be used as a penetrating weapon of sorts. The Japanese took the sword art form to another level, being very precise in the attacks, going for weak points in the armor and such. When speaking of Europeans weapons, the sharpness is not as important as the swords were used for cleaving and hacking. It's not the sharpness of the blade, per se, but the impat that is doing the damage. Most Europeans weapons were sharp on the tips for stabbing, and the blades were not at sharp, and were used for parrying and such. Do a google and check out some of the results, I'll try to find some good articles about this subject and share. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hopcroft Posted January 9, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2004 Originally posted by ZootSoot In the real world sharpness depends upon hardness. A very sharp blade is, of necessity a brittle blade, while a flexible, durable blade cannot hold the same sort of edge. Infinitely sharp can best be represented by an extremely large KA AVLD (20 dice maybe, maybe more). Infintely sharp? As in "this sword was forged by magic on the Elemntal Plane of Sharpness" sharp? I have a hard time imagning something that shapr. At least the wielder should be greateful the hilt isn't sharp.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dugfromthearth Posted January 10, 2004 Report Share Posted January 10, 2004 okay some stuff: Japanenese swords were very sharp, and generally brittle. They did not use them to parry because they would probably break. They were good against leather armor or unarmored people. Because the were so sharp the scabbards were made of wood with a curved interior that pinched the sides of the blade to hold it instead of blocking the edge of the blade as noted above. Broadswords were made of lower quality steel from the early medieval period. They were broad because the metal wasn't strong enough to be thin and not break. The edges were somewhat dull because if they were thin they would break on armor. The weight of the weapon made them good at smacking people around and they could penetrate armor fairly well (at least the chainmail used at the time). Longswords were made of higher quality steel at the end of the medieval era. They were thinner because the metal was strong enough to be thin and not break all the time. It should be noted that both broadswords and longswords broke constantly. It was common for your sword to break in a battle, most knights carried a mace or flail as a back up since those would not break. Longswords were not heavy enough to deliver as solid a blow as a broadsword. So they did not penetrate armor as easily. But they were easier to wield. In reality the sharpness of a blade reduces the resistance it meets when it cuts. The edge is not the whole issue though. If you swing an axe into a tree the edge will bite in but the sides will get stuck. No matter how sharp you make an axe edge it won't chop through a tree in one blow, the head won't fit. This should be treated as penetrating or armor piercing. Defenses are ignored but it can only do a limited amount of damage. Assuming a razor thin blade with an infinitely sharp edge it would simply slice through anything. Black Knight's sword in Marvel comics does this. Technically this would be an infinite hka with the "real weapon" limitation to indicate you couldn't stab and destroy the world with one blow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuSoardGraphite Posted January 10, 2004 Report Share Posted January 10, 2004 "Infinitely Sharp" So sharp that it can slice through Atoms? Or so sharp that it can slice through Quarks? * Defintitely an NND or AVLD attack, but what could protect you from such an attack? Not even a FF should work according to the SFX... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted January 10, 2004 Report Share Posted January 10, 2004 Originally posted by NuSoardGraphite "Infinitely Sharp" So sharp that it can slice through Atoms? Or so sharp that it can slice through Quarks? * So sharp that it cuts the very fabric of space and time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hopcroft Posted January 10, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2004 Originally posted by Old Man So sharp that it cuts the very fabric of space and time. Now that's a sword that needs a dulling spell to be placed in its sheath! What are the game effects of cutting the fabric of space-time? This particular sword is sharp enough that it can cut into the astral plane, affecting beings with astral bodies. You could slay Sauron with a sword like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gewing Posted January 11, 2004 Report Share Posted January 11, 2004 Read "The subtle Knife" by PHillip Pullman.... EWWWW Originally posted by Michael Hopcroft Now that's a sword that needs a dulling spell to be placed in its sheath! What are the game effects of cutting the fabric of space-time? This particular sword is sharp enough that it can cut into the astral plane, affecting beings with astral bodies. You could slay Sauron with a sword like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted January 11, 2004 Report Share Posted January 11, 2004 Originally posted by Old Man So sharp that it cuts the very fabric of space and time. At that point you need to add X-Dim travel to it and call it a plot device... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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