farik Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 So in your super hero campaign world does the Pope have Super powers? If greek gods and norse gods are handing out the divine super strength is the Christian god holding back? What about the Jeweish big guy? Is Allah sending a representative to the party? Now why or why don't you feel comfortable with contemporary religious superheroes? I've decided to empower the Pope in my setting and I was surprised by how taken aback some of my players were so I'm wondering about the similar experiences of the assembled Herodom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeAsianKid Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 .......................... Dude, Jews and Christians believe in the same god..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farik Posted February 4, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by SomeAsianKid Dude, Jews and Christians believe in the same god..... Well so do the Muslims but that same God seems to have several different opinions about things depending on who worships It. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent X Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Being Christian, I don't really try to role play this sort of stuff. It's too close to home. The idea of putting stats on my God or role playing his reaction to things, no thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Watcher Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 It could be argued that mutant and accidentally-granted powers are God-given gifts to humanity, to be used for good or ill as Free Will dictates. EDIT: I could easily see the Vatican and other mainstream churches taking this stance officially in the CU (And they might have. Don't have the books with me to look it up). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farik Posted February 4, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by Agent X Being Christian, I don't really try to role play this sort of stuff. It's too close to home. The idea of putting stats on my God or role playing his reaction to things, no thanks. You answered my question by saying you find it uncomfortable but just to clarify I'm not asking if you "stat out" or role play "God" I'm asking if "God" has representation in your setting. Just because the Pope has Super powers wouldn't prove that God exists after all it could just be a deluded Mutant or a conniving alien. On the other hand in a world so filled with super powered wonders wouldn't it be suspect if the big churches didn't have comparable special effects? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent X Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by farik You answered my question by saying you find it uncomfortable but just to clarify I'm not asking if you "stat out" or role play "God" I'm asking if "God" has representation in your setting. Just because the Pope has Super powers wouldn't prove that God exists after all it could just be a deluded Mutant or a conniving alien. On the other hand in a world so filled with super powered wonders wouldn't it be suspect if the big churches didn't have comparable special effects? I handle it this way - there are supers who have strong religious convictions - and God Moves in Mysterious Ways so I don't have to worry about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WhammeWhamme Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 I've never built a Superworld where actual deities existed in a tangible form. Were I to use, say, the Norse Pantheon, and make them actual mystic beings, I'd feel obliged to have them actually be worshipped. I'd also have to find a reason to NOT have the Christian god acting directly, since 'Worship me or I shall smite thee' is pretting convincing. Having GOD taking an active role would certainly be a way to handle that. I'm not religious, so giving the Pope divine superpowers wouldn't really bother me. HOWEVER, I'd probably be a little more.. subtle? ==> God does not intervene directly. However Christians, for no apparent reason, are about 15% more likely to develop superpowers... and in all conflicts with 'Pagans', there has been ONE true believer who devised strategies that worked out for the best while being contrary to reason. Otherwise, I'd have a world where the 'real' Gods were worshipped and rule directly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 The pope is a representative, not God himself. So maybe as a high priest of some sort it might work. But it's not something I've done. I've made an evil anti-pope, but that's another story. I've run games where the gods were merely high-powered heroes (a la Thor and Hercules from Marvel), but I haven't had the god appear of any contemporary religion. It's not that I feel it would be sacreligious (since I'm by no means religious), it's more that I don't want to make any other players uncomfortable and I'm not as fascianted by the monotheistic gods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest innominatus Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 How does the saying go? "Jesus Saves; everyone else takes full damage." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by farik Well so do the Muslims but that same God seems to have several different opinions about things depending on who worships It. In The Ultimate Super Mage author Dean Shomshak posited that all the gods of ancient myth, and the gods of the monotheistic religions actually did exist, but were the creations of the faith of their worshippers. (This was purely for game universe conventions, and placed no value judgement on real-world religions.) Supreme divinity did exist, but it was not the same as God as it was popularly believed to be by the various religions' worshippers. I got a kick out of angels attending to the spirits of Jewish, Christian and Muslim worshippers in the afterlife, but having to pretend that the other faiths' followers weren't there. As the great "ethical" religions grew more widespread, they pushed the older pagan gods away from contact with Earth and into their own mystical realm (Dean called this "the Ban"). Ironically, since these religions conceived of divine affairs as primarily outside the sphere of Earthly intervention, these new gods were restrained by the Ban nearly as much as the mythic gods. However, in the mid-Twentieth Century some event weakened the Ban, allowing these "divine" powers to begin manifesting on Earth again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoneDaddy Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 I've been noodling with Barabas, a mino character from the New Testament. He didn't get crucified so Jesus could. He can never die. He's a highly skilled normal with immunity to aging, special detect (evil) and a LOT of luck. Also quite Christian, having met the Guy briefly. Not really a pacifist, but he has a CvKilling that won't quit, unless you happen to be evil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bengal Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 When I ran a campaign based loosely on the Mystery Men in 1995, there was a guy named Super-Pope, but he wasn't the real Pope, but rather a normal guy who dressed up like the Pope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 I've been involved with a couple Greek gods as NPCs. They were basically just "regular" supers. We decided to make them immortal in the sense they did not age. But could die. As in they took enough body. Though they also had regenertion so you would have to hit'em hard and often to kill. But as a Christian my opinion would be yes maybe have a character with superpowers as a gift from God. But not any direct type stuff. As in God would not be written down as a character or something that would be a little sacreligious (sp?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assault Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by Lord Liaden In As the great "ethical" religions grew more widespread, they pushed the older pagan gods away from contact with Earth and into their own mystical realm (Dean called this "the Ban"). Ironically, since these religions conceived of divine affairs as primarily outside the sphere of Earthly intervention, these new gods were restrained by the Ban nearly as much as the mythic gods. Interesting. I wonder how this would have impacted on Hinduism? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by assault Interesting. I wonder how this would have impacted on Hinduism? According to Dean, pretty much the same as with all the other faiths. There are two main strains within modern Hinduism: the worship of a multitude of gods (devas) similar to pantheistic faiths; and the credo of a supreme godhead, Brahma, who although depicted as a trinity (Brahman, Vishnu and Shiva) is essentially a single omnipotent deity. The other gods are often considered to be aspects or avatars of the trinity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trebuchet Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by Badger But as a Christian my opinion would be yes maybe have a character with superpowers as a gift from God. But not any direct type stuff. In our campaign my character Zl'f, a devout Russian Orthodox, honestly considers her powers to be a gift from God. Another character is an avatar for the Apache storm diety Thunderbird. A third character is an immortal Roman Catholic priest who was a founder of the Templars. It may not be as important whether powers are actually granted by the gods or God as it is that the character sincerely believes it. After all, tremendous good and evil has been done over the centuries by perfectly normal (and nonsuperpowered) humans in the name of God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supreme Serpent Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 The Pope DOES have a superpower....he's infallible! We've had characters that are strongly religious. We also had in one game a character "Bishop" who was a super-powered Vatican representative. (Quickly nicknamed "Arcwelder of the Lord" by the group for his massive lightning attack) In one session, we were all fighting big mystic badguy and our group was sucked through a magic portal - cliffhanger end. Next session, we find out we went to "hell". Bishop's player was late, so he only showed up AFTER we got back. We were all impressed that super-bishop did not, in fact, go to hell when the rest of us did. Frogman started being much more religious after that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Re: Super Pope? Originally posted by farik So in your super hero campaign world does the Pope have Super powers? No superpowers for old John Paul, though I'd be temped to give some nifty super-gadget to his PopeMobile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayday Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by farik On the other hand in a world so filled with super powered wonders wouldn't it be suspect if the big churches didn't have comparable special effects? Isn't that called Miracles? I am a mythology fan but oddly enough, I've never even thought about making an avatar or angel or religion based character. The closest I have is a rogue android who believes he is a messenger of God, but its actually just faulty wiring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mentor Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Originally posted by Agent X Being Christian, I don't really try to role play this sort of stuff. It's too close to home. The idea of putting stats on my God or role playing his reaction to things, no thanks. Same with our campaign. Even the agnostics or atheists are respectful of the believers in our group in their treatment of religious issues. On the other hand, as in Highlander and vampire lore, Holy ground is real and powerful, whether its a church, the wailing wall in Jerusalem, or the Mescalero burial grounds, China's Wudan mountain, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent X Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Originally posted by Lord Liaden In The Ultimate Super Mage author Dean Shomshak posited that all the gods of ancient myth, and the gods of the monotheistic religions actually did exist, but were the creations of the faith of their worshippers. (This was purely for game universe conventions, and placed no value judgement on real-world religions.) Supreme divinity did exist, but it was not the same as God as it was popularly believed to be by the various religions' worshippers. I got a kick out of angels attending to the spirits of Jewish, Christian and Muslim worshippers in the afterlife, but having to pretend that the other faiths' followers weren't there. As the great "ethical" religions grew more widespread, they pushed the older pagan gods away from contact with Earth and into their own mystical realm (Dean called this "the Ban"). Ironically, since these religions conceived of divine affairs as primarily outside the sphere of Earthly intervention, these new gods were restrained by the Ban nearly as much as the mythic gods. However, in the mid-Twentieth Century some event weakened the Ban, allowing these "divine" powers to begin manifesting on Earth again. This didn't work for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent X Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Originally posted by Supreme Serpent The Pope DOES have a superpower....he's infallible! We've had characters that are strongly religious. We also had in one game a character "Bishop" who was a super-powered Vatican representative. (Quickly nicknamed "Arcwelder of the Lord" by the group for his massive lightning attack) In one session, we were all fighting big mystic badguy and our group was sucked through a magic portal - cliffhanger end. Next session, we find out we went to "hell". Bishop's player was late, so he only showed up AFTER we got back. We were all impressed that super-bishop did not, in fact, go to hell when the rest of us did. Frogman started being much more religious after that... LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug McCrae Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 Well the 'big guy' exists in both the Marvel and DC universes - the Living Tribunal and the Spectre work for Him. Also Grant Morrison introduced a real superpowered angel in his run on JLA. The Pope doesn't have powers but AFAIK IRL the Catholic Church has never claimed he does, whereas angels, gods and the like are supposed to have special powers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rechan Posted February 5, 2004 Report Share Posted February 5, 2004 The Pope may not have powers himself, but you can be Dang sure the Vatican has a hand in some things. Imagine the Vatican training a person with Regeneration to be a paladin, to fight Demonic beings, or "evils" like monsters. Imagine religious fanatics who try to "clense" any religious group from having Superpowered beings in it, claiming that the powers are not divine in nature. I had even considered a side adventure where a Buddhist or Christian with "divine" powers started a monestary in Millenium City's sewers, collecting the homeless and training them as monks. I think powers that are "divine" in nature are COOL; even if they are or are not from a divine source, I'm cool with whatever concept works. I mean, if we can have Egyptian/Greek/Norse gods, why not have some others? I've been tooling with the prospect of a Taoist Priest, with quasi-mystical powers, or maybe a Shinto spirit located in the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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