Registration Schemes

[Clonus]

1.  Captain America didn't exist in the world you described.  In the comics he existed in a world where there were already superbeings, and the government managed to create one of their own.  In that situation, where you already have costumed beings running around, it makes sense to use him that way.  In the movie version, he wasn't supposed to be running around in costume at all.  In both versions, the intent was to have an army of super-soldiers, not guys in costume.

 

2.  I don't think it makes sense as a setup.  I don't see how you ever get to that world.  "Everyone is going to automatically assume you are a villain, even the other heroes."  The insinuation is that people aren't going to wait to see if you commit a crime, they're just going to attack you on sight.  It's so far removed from both standard superhero stories and the real world (real world as in the level of trust people have in government) that I don't buy it.  It feels very forced and artificial.

 

1.  I did not describe a world in which there were no superbeings before the start of the war.  Quite the contrary.  If there were no superbeings, there would be nothing to register.  Assume the default supers world up until 1941, complete with guys who dress in circus costumes or run around in masks and trenchcoats to fight mobsters and mad scientists.  Now war breaks out and the American government imposes draft registration, including a line on the registration form in which they ask men to reveal special abilities that would make them particularly useful in combat or for intelligence gathering.  What kind of man decides to lie on his form and conceal that he happens to be bullet-proof?  

 

2.  Actually it's an old standard in comic books that if two heroes meet for the first time and one of them has never heard of the other or one of them has a dodgy rep, they'll start to fight under the assumption that the other guy is a criminal.  (Often of course, they're meeting at a fresh crime scene which helps create the mistake).  In the real world if a cop encounters a civilian with a gun out the absolute first thing it'll do is tell the civilian to put down the gun...if the civilian's lucky.  And of course doctors and lawyers have no sense of humour when someone attempts to go into their line without credentials.  

[Clonus]

Actually now that I think about it, there's another variation and that IS the super-soldier alternative.  Assuming that it's not a setting where super-powers just spontaneously happen, that super heroes are built, injected, or whatever, registration might be a legal prerequisite to even getting the powers.  

[DusterBoy]

I love Bob Greenwade's concept of superhero sanction as a kind of professional accreditation system for metahumans and the fact that the system incentivises people to become sanctioned by providing them with so many advantages unavailable to non-sanctioned supers. I would definitely be using a modified version of it myself if I ran a Champions campaign.

[Hermit]

Farewell Speech

 

Super-Dude:  Oh yes, I'm sorry, last thing I promise.  Tomorrow marks 90 days since the last appearance of Mrs. Mephistopheles, the 7th dimensional demon princess sorceress.  You might remember the last time she came to Earth and transformed everyone on the planet into cartoon animals, and then enslaved you, and I made her leave by tricking her into saying the name of the Lord while on holy ground.  Just like I have the last 37 times she appeared, every 90 days for the past 9+ years.  So, you know.  You might wanna do something about that.

 

Super-Dude steps away from podium.

 

Atlas League leaves.

That whole thing was awesome 

[Houston GM]

Additional Scenario:

 

Arrest records / super-criminal database

 

If you are arrested, the police officer processing you has the obligation to list any known superpowers on your arrest record. (The officer also has the option to list any suspected power in a different section.)

 

If you are arrested and have superpowers, the information on the arrest record is uploaded to the national database. Your fingerprints will be in the system, etc.

 

 

 

This scenario has the ability to be generally accepted by the public, and by many law-abiding superpowered people, because it only applies to people getting arrested.

 

It's also the source of tensions, because individuals can abuse it. One police officer may start arresting local super-powered individuals for moving violations and other nuisance charges just so he can put them in the national system. Another police officer may decide not to mention on an arrest record that the kid he caught shoplifting could phase his hand through the display case (even though that's a violation of the rules).

[Alverant]

Doubt it.  What do you think a neighborhood watch is?

 

A group of people who abide by a certain set of rules who check out their neighborhood and report anything suspicious. They don't chase down people they think may be doing something and beat them up for the police.

 

As for a registration act, since we have licenses for plumbers, building contractors, bounty hunters, doctors, and other occupations it's not unreasonable to expect the same for those with powers who want to use them in combat. Those licenses exist as a guarantee of a certain level of competence as well as provide legal protections and obligations. Again, it's not unreasonable to expect the same for wannbe superheroes. Even the cops are required to get specialized training. As for enforcement, it usually doesn't happen until something goes wrong. If Super-dude doesn't accidentally knock over a few skyscrapers he should be OK. If he does, then he is about as dangerous as Grond and should be stopped.

 

Opposition to a lack of registration laws isn't well thought out. I wonder if Super-dude would quit over speed limits as well.

[Greywind]

A group of people who abide by a certain set of rules who check out their neighborhood and report anything suspicious. They don't chase down people they think may be doing something and beat them up for the police.

 

...George Zimmerman.Trayvon Martin...

[Hermit]

I tend to play fast and loose with a lot of things in my campaign, so the current CU's take suits me fine.

 

However, I did once play a campaign where superheroes had to wear costumes that were colorful and distinctive, by law, when in performance of fighting crime and protecting the public good. The law was enacted so that people would know to get the heck out of the way when they saw someone with a cape entering a situation. It lead to fakes and confusion sometimes, but also a lot of fun.

 

"You saved the day... that's nice. You plan on doing this often?"

"Well, I guess now that I have powers...yeah."

"Great... get out of the blue jeans and ironic T shirt, and put on some colorful tights, and maybe a cape. It's like brake lights, people need warning!"

[pinecone]

A group of people who abide by a certain set of rules who check out their neighborhood and report anything suspicious. They don't chase down people they think may be doing something and beat them up for the police.

 

As for a registration act, since we have licenses for plumbers, building contractors, bounty hunters, doctors, and other occupations it's not unreasonable to expect the same for those with powers who want to use them in combat. Those licenses exist as a guarantee of a certain level of competence as well as provide legal protections and obligations. Again, it's not unreasonable to expect the same for wannbe superheroes. Even the cops are required to get specialized training. As for enforcement, it usually doesn't happen until something goes wrong. If Super-dude doesn't accidentally knock over a few skyscrapers he should be OK. If he does, then he is about as dangerous as Grond and should be stopped.

 

Opposition to a lack of registration laws isn't well thought out. I wonder if Super-dude would quit over speed limits as well.

reasonable, safe, and sane? Yeah, most supers would be down with that... heavy handed controlling freak? I can see a fair amount of "no thanks"

I have a little bit of wince factor for "How do I know you are Qualified to save my life!"

I normally say a licence is required to be "official" that includes "official" police cooperation, think barman on tv, vs barman in the comics.

[bubba smith]

don't you mean BATMAN not barman ?

[pinecone]

don't you mean BATMAN not barman ?

Freaking Kindle#!?$@, I really hate "auto incorrect"

[Christopher R Taylor]

I'd forgotten about Greenwade's system, he has done great work with Oregon for Champions.  The guy is a great Hero designer and writer, wish he'd have more success financially.

[Greywind]

don't you mean BATMAN not barman ?

 

Barman from Cheers vs the barman from Cocktail

[bigdamnhero]

He's the bartender we need, not the bartender we deserve.

[Hermit]

You guys are really tempting me to start up a thread on a super bar I've been working on

[carmachu]

What about if the character is patrolling looking for criminal activity?  That probably would be consider vigilante behavior.

 

 

Prove it. Burden of proof is on the law side. Just because one is walking down the street or flying overhead doesnt mean its patrolling. You get a much better view above, but on the other hand there is no traffic.....

[bigbywolfe]

Prove it. Burden of proof is on the law side. Just because one is walking down the street or flying overhead doesnt mean its patrolling. You get a much better view above, but on the other hand there is no traffic.....

Might be hard to prove after the first incident, but after a half dozen cases of you just happening to stop a crime while "strolling" above the street in a brightly colored costume and using a code name...

[massey]

Might be hard to prove after the first incident, but after a half dozen cases of you just happening to stop a crime while "strolling" above the street in a brightly colored costume and using a code name...

 

Again, not against the law.  And I'm sure the people you saved who were held at gunpoint in the bank robbery you just stopped will be out for your blood. 

[bigbywolfe]

Again, not against the law.  And I'm sure the people you saved who were held at gunpoint in the bank robbery you just stopped will be out for your blood. 

Actually, yeah, it pretty much is.  In most cases if you have a physical altercation with someone you will have to identify yourself to the police.  Also, we're talking about police, politics, and vigilante laws, not the opinion of possible rescue-ies, so   yourself.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Its not against the law to patrol.  Its not against the law to arrest criminals or stop crime, if you're very careful about procedure and how you handle a criminal.  Not that this comes up much in comics, because its depressing and miserable to have the cops leaning on heroes for doing right.

[Greywind]

It falls under citizen's arrest. If the citizen is in the wrong, there's the possibility of lawsuit (both criminal and civil), the possibility of arrest, etc.

 

As bigby pointed out in post #42, if there are actual laws against, and you continually do it, sorry, but you are a habitual criminal. Quite possibly with mental issues for running around in spandex, flying not withstanding.

[Deadman]

I guess my take on the all of the options being thrown out there is that it is an exercise in speculation at best.  I think this speaks to the level of inconvenience the GM wants to put on his players. 

 

I honestly think that if any of this were to actually happen in the real world the Government would immediately take steps to control it.  Of course everything would be fine as long as there was no collateral damage, civilian casualties or mass chaos.  I doubt that is likely to happen for long.  Once the court of public opinion has been turned on the prospective hero I imagine the Government Super-Goon squad would be tasked with bringing in the offender.  At that point I would guess they would be forced to become part of said squad, undergo monitoring, incarcerated or otherwise controlled.  I cannot see the Government leaving such power in the hands of average civilians without controls in place.

 

In my games I don't tend to address it much.  I usually hint at the proposal of a Registration but never really enforce it until I need a plot hook along that line.  Even when I do bring it up it usually doesn't go far since in most cases the PCs are at least loosely Government sponsored.

 

Just my $.02,

[massey]

Actually, yeah, it pretty much is.  In most cases if you have a physical altercation with someone you will have to identify yourself to the police.  Also, we're talking about police, politics, and vigilante laws, not the opinion of possible rescue-ies, so   yourself.

 

No, it's not illegal.  Generally anyone may stop a crime in progress.  The laws of specific states and cities may vary, but making a citizen's arrest isn't vigilante behavior.  We know this because cities and states also have laws allowing for citizen's arrest.

 

While the police may want to talk to you about it, there generally aren't laws requiring you to hang around and speak with them.

[massey]

 

I honestly think that if any of this were to actually happen in the real world the Government would immediately take steps to control it.  Of course everything would be fine as long as there was no collateral damage, civilian casualties or mass chaos.  I doubt that is likely to happen for long.  Once the court of public opinion has been turned on the prospective hero I imagine the Government Super-Goon squad would be tasked with bringing in the offender.  At that point I would guess they would be forced to become part of said squad, undergo monitoring, incarcerated or otherwise controlled.  I cannot see the Government leaving such power in the hands of average civilians without controls in place.

 

 

That presumes that the government has a Super-Goon squad.  And if they do have one, why aren't they stopping the super-villains?  I always found it ridiculous that the government would spend all these resources looking for a way to take down the Caped Wonder, when people like Doctor Annihilation are running around.

[SKJAM!]

"You mean Secretary of Metahuman Affairs Doctor Annihilation."

 

One of the things that made Marvel's registration plotline so silly was that about three months in-universe before that, it had been revealed that the U.S. government had made the Red Skull secretary of the Defense Department, so naturally the heroes aren't going to be thrilled about giving the feds all their personal info and agreeing to follow orders.