Guesswork: Hero System Book of Templates 3

[steriaca]

This thread is a think of what would be in the third book of Templates. Christoph has voiced a desire to do one of DC Comics proxies. Here is my list of characters most likely to be included and whyish.

 

The Big Three

Basically it would be fully to do a book of DC Comics proxies without Flying Mammal Man (Batman), the Man of the Future (Superman), nor the Woman of Wonder (Wonder Woman). Because they are the big names, they should exist in the two cost range of all the big characters of the books.

 

Also I expect that they will have some of the support characters in the book. Bird Boy (Robin), Clownman (Joker), Science Buisnessman (Lex Luthor), Alien Android (Braniac), Wicked Cat (Cheetah), and Grow Woman (Gargantuala) might be included. That's nine already. 

 

The Silver Three 

One can't have a book of DC Comics proxies without the Wielder of an Alien Artifact (Green Lantern), Vibrating Speedster (The Flash), and Shapshifting Alien Detective (Martian Manhunter). That increases it to twelve.

 

The We Bought Them From Other Companies Three

DC Comics has a nasty habit of buying characters from failed comic book companies. Three of the biggest are Mystical Avatar (Captain Marvel aka Shazam), Plastfied Prankster (Plastic Man), and Blue Insect Man (Blue Beetle 2). Now we have fifteen.

 

The Vertigo Three

We can't exactly forget the adult branch of the DC Comics Universe.  We have the Sleep Inducing Detective (the original Sandman ), the Living Vegetation (Swamp Thing), and Mystical Detective (John Constine ). Now we have 18.

 

So...what would your list be?

[Tjack]

   I might change your “Blue Insect Man” into “Gadget Man” thus saving the name “Red & Blue Insect Man” for the wall crawling, web slinging guy from across the street.

   I might also include a “Big Thinker” character like Martian Manhunter, Captain Comet or Saturn Girl.  Though psionics aren’t used much in DC, they are a popular character type in general.

[Duke Bushido]

You could dig really deep and resurrect the characters Archie Comics bought and cant quite make catch on.

[Christopher R Taylor]

I'd probably swap out The Question for Captain Marvel (too powerful) and Hawkman for Martian Manhunter, just because of the vast point totals

[steriaca]

1 hour ago, Tjack said:

   I might change your “Blue Insect Man” into “Gadget Man” thus saving the name “Red & Blue Insect Man” for the wall crawling, web slinging guy from across the street.

   I might also include a “Big Thinker” character like Martian Manhunter, Captain Comet or Saturn Girl.  Though psionics aren’t used much in DC, they are a popular character type in general.

Book of Templates 1 already has a version of Spiderman, and I am not writing the book. I'm predicting what may be in it.

 

And the writer is going to be the one to scrub the details out of them to make them generic enough. 

Just now, Christopher R Taylor said:

I'd probably swap out The Question for Captain Marvel (too powerful) and Hawkman for Martian Manhunter, just because of the vast point totals

And talking about the writer...well it's his book. And yes Question and Hawkman are damm good substitutes. 

[Tjack]

37 minutes ago, Duke Bushido said:

You could dig really deep and resurrect the characters Archie Comics bought and cant quite make catch on.

The Web, was a Tarantula expy who in the spy craze of the ‘60’s became part of an organization of the same name.

The Shield was a Capt. America expy. 
The Comet was a flying blaster.

The Jaguar was costumed werewolf type.

   I’ll have to check on the others, but that company was also bought by DC comics in the ‘90’s.  It was renamed “The Impact Universe”.   So they fit the slot for “We Bought ‘em’s”.

    I just checked.

   The Fly was a flying Spider-Man expy.

   The Black Hood was kind of a Punisher Lite

and as a team they were known as The Crusaders

    

[steriaca]

DC also has a fetish for numbers. Both 3 and 52 are sacred to them. (Ok. We might be the one who fetishize 3.) So between two books could we have 52 characters between them?

 

Ok...some rules.

1) No redos. if a character can be expressed in a past book with a different skill set, than that character shouldn't be reprinted.

2) No VPP's in the based character. The Batman proxy can have a VVP in the second write up, but John Constine should instead use a Variable Special Effects on his mystic blasts. Constine also probably has Variable Limitations on his magic, which explained why he would rather play cons against the supernatural than cast spells (Side Effects anyone?).

3) Cult characters are ok, but the reader has to be able to identify them. So Like Hippy Dippy Doll Man (Brother Power, the Geek) and Teenage President of a United Country (Prez) may not do.

[steriaca]

Humm...the possibilities. 

 

Doom Patrol: The original three might be doable. Size and Shape Altering Lass (Elastic Girl), Mechaman (Robotman), and Anti-Positive Alen Spector and Anti-Positive Alen Spector Holder (Negative Man) are doable. Multiple Personality Girl (Crazy Jane ) and Sentiant Roadway (Danny The Street) are not. One of my favorite Doom Patrol characters who I loved before he became a Doom Patrol member is Anoying Transdimentinal Insect Guy (Ambush Bug).

 

Justice League: Martian Manhunter is out because he might cost a lot of points (Superman + Mental Powers + Shapeshifting + Desolification), but out of all the characters I haven't listed are Sonic Songbird (Black Cannery ), Vibrating Breakdancer (Vibe), and of course Sea King (Aquaman).

 

Additional Villain Characters: If we have Sea King we must have Devilfish (Black Manta). With Vibrating Speedster comes Sargent Snow ([b]Captain Cold[/b]), Mister Reflection ([b]Mirror Master[/b]), Throwing Stick Guy ([b]Captain Boomarang[/b]), I could go on. There is also Silly Lady Clown ([b]Harlly Quinn[/b].

 

Who would you add?

[Scott Ruggels]

Scion of Anubis (Dr. Fate), Unkillable Man (Solomon Grundy) ,The Metallic Wonders (Metal Men), Time traveling Celebrity (Booster Gold), just off the top of my head, though Dr. Fate might be too many points. 

[assault]

Obviously some of the key characters are point hogs, but there are a bunch of others that aren't 

 

So while a write up for the Man of Steel will be over the top, there could also be a 1938 version of him and a cut down Maid of Might as well.

 

Teenage partner versions would be possible as well. There are useful analogues of most of the main characters, as well as others like Cybernetic Organism, Animal Shapeshifter and so on.

 

I wouldn't go out of my way to include bought in characters in Volume 3. If they fit,they fit, but I wouldn't make them a priority.

 

[steriaca]

14 minutes ago, assault said:

Obviously some of the key characters are point hogs, but there are a bunch of others that aren't 

 

So while a write up for the Man of Steel will be over the top, there could also be a 1938 version of him and a cut down Maid of Might as well.

It's kinda common sense that the Big Three (Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman) will have two different writeups. Just like Hulk and Spiderman are in the first book. Supergirl might be a possibility.

 

Some characters like the Martian Manhunter, if done, might be too expensive and just plain odd to hand off to a newcomer to the system.  Others are odd for veterans of the roleplaying wars (example: Danny the Street, the crossdressing boulevard).

14 minutes ago, assault said:

 

Teenage partner versions would be possible as well. There are useful analogues of most of the main characters, as well as others like Cybernetic Organism, Animal Shapeshifter and so on.

Humm....the (Teen) Titans? Prehaps. But I'm not the writer. I'm just tossing things on a wall, and asking others to do the same.

14 minutes ago, assault said:

 

I wouldn't go out of my way to include bought in characters in Volume 3. If they fit,they fit, but I wouldn't make them a priority.

 

Well, what else would Volume 3 be? It was already something in volume 1 (as the original author forgotten that Templates were what we use to call Package Deals).

 

...which reminds me...I would pay money for "this is what skills you need to be a reporter" and "this is what skills you need to be a cop", etc. 

[HeroGM]

One of the biggest issues with the Distinguished Competition is how high of a point values the characters have. IIRC (from Facebook talk) that's why it's been Marvellous characters so far - easier to define as 400 or so points.

 

What if like to see honestly is a book of templated Villian's and vehicle/bases. I view this series the way the 80s had OHotMU and Who's Who.

4 hours ago, steriaca said:

...which reminds me...I would pay money for "this is what skills you need to be a reporter" and "this is what skills you need to be a cop", etc. 

 

Dark Champions and Pulp Hero go a long way for that IMHO.

[steriaca]

The MJL stuff DC only rented. Archive Comics/Red Circle/MJL has it back.

 

As for Milestone (Static, among others), we can use them. Also Wildstorm.

[assault]

Thinking about it... it's really only Superman that's a problem. The rest can be sorted by "not being greedy", or not going overboard on what they can do. It just needs Superman to be sorted out in order to provide the benchmarks.

Batman: Don't be greedy.
Wonder Woman: Kind of neat, with some interesting powers, but not really All That Awesome.
Flash: Get Superman right first.
Green Lantern: Not all that, inferior to Batman aside from his powers, and get Superman right.
Aquaman: Surprisingly easy once you work out that it is Fish Telekinesis, not Fish Telepathy.
Martian Manhunter: The Superman Plus stuff is massively overrated.

Once you have the founders of the JLA in place, everything is fine.

It reduces to Superman.

[Asperion]

We could generate some form of hive mind. Numerous examples abound but the most (in)famous has to be the Borg from Star Trek. 

[steriaca]

31 minutes ago, Asperion said:

We could generate some form of hive mind. Numerous examples abound but the most (in)famous has to be the Borg from Star Trek. 

Well, there is Billy Numerous around (a Teen Titans villain with Duplication as a special effect).

[Christopher R Taylor]

Wonder Woman is nearly Superman with magic lasso, she's more spendy than you might think

[Sketchpad]

19 hours ago, HeroGM said:

What if like to see honestly is a book of templated Villian's and vehicle/bases. I view this series the way the 80s had OHotMU and Who's Who.

 

Reminds me of some game material I've made.

[assault]

A sad thought: you can design a decent Superman type for around 600-800 points using 1-3 edition  That's using the benchmarks implied in the text and apparently used in George Mac Donald's game.

 

You would need ten times that many points these days.

[steriaca]

I just bought Book of Templates 2 in Drive Throu (I always have problems buying stuff on the Hero Games website itself). I have to say, good work on it.

[steriaca]

Humm...I noticed that Scarlet Sorceress has a 30 point VVP. Prehaps Occult Baskart Detective (John Constine) can have a VVP also...

[steriaca]

Hero System Book of Templates Book 4.

 

 

Heavenly Body Magical Princess (Sailor Moon).

Punching Spirit Holder (Jotaru Kujo/Star Platinum).

Vampiric King of Punching Spirits (Dio!).

Youngest With Obedient Giant Mecha (Giant Robo).

Summoner of Monsters (Jadeite, Nephrite, Zoicite, Kunzite, and basically any mid level bad guy from Sailor Moon).

Gifted Card Game Wizard (Yugi Muto/Pharaoh Atem).

Jealous Alien Princess (Lum).

The Nasty Duo (Yuri and Kei, the Dirty Pair).

 

Humm....who would you add to the list. Note: I use anime/manga characters but it needs not be just that.

[Khymeria]

Wow, this is some really cool feedback.  I really appreciate it and have definitely monkeyed around with builds from the Distinguished Competition, because the build tend to be a bit higher and a different type of game is represented.  I tried to include things that are tricky builds or build types that I haven't done yet.  Obviously something with a vehicle or cave full of them is something that hasn't been done yet.  The Ring Guy (VPP) is another that I have not shown much of that type of power yet, although a bit with Crimson Sorceress, but more of an aside to the main power.  I am a fan of Plastified Prankster (my 2nd favorite superhero) and Blue Bug Man, classic and new kid, so I would probably include those as neither type has been represented.  Multiple Last Son of Dying Planet would be a must, one resembling the classic cartoon by Max Fleischer and another more in line with the Justice League cartoon more than likely.  I might also do a rhyming medieval fire breathing demon who happened to first appear the same month I was born.  I grew up on Challenge of the Super Friends so Native American Giant is something that I would dig putting in as well as Boo Yah Bot and Two Minds Make One Tough Character.  

[Khymeria]

On 10/18/2021 at 3:49 PM, steriaca said:

...which reminds me...I would pay money for "this is what skills you need to be a reporter" and "this is what skills you need to be a cop", etc. 

I am working on this currently but for a more detective/horror based setting, Gaslight for Hero (project title, not actual title) and include Reporter, Academic, Inventor, Scientist, Occultist/Psychic, Cowboy, Savage, Retired Military, Doctor, Detective, Explorer, and Noble.  It is an excellent companion piece for @Christopher R TaylorWestern Hero as it set in the same time frame and just across the pond.  Dracula, Invisible Man, Professor Moriarty, Dorian Gray, Spring-Heeled Jack, Jack the RIpper, and a whole lot more.  The focus is on 100 point starting PCs.  Hopefully coming very soon.

[steriaca]

I can see Book of Templates 3 and 4 being basically full of DC proxies. Book of Templates 5 should be independent comic book character proxies and manga proxies. If it should warrant, should Book of Templates 6 be proxies of non comic book characters? (Ape Presuing Plummer anyone?)