After the Ultimate Evil... what?

[DocMan]

Ok, you've formed a group of heros. You've met challenges. You've sprung back from defeat. You've grown in power and wisdom. Events have built to the point that you've had to deal with Ultimate Evil for the sake of all. You've prepared for it. You've faced it. You've won the day. And some of your number have actually survived.

 

Now what?

 

How do you move on when you've faced the worst the Universe can throw at you and won? What does it mean for your campaign?

 

Doc

[Fenixcrest]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Now that you've beaten the worst your universe can throw at you, you have to face the worst that other universes can throw at you. Evil elder gods, anybody?

[DocMan]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

So things continue to escalate? What happens when your heros realized that they've trapped themselves in a never-ending war against progressively tougher opponents.

 

"Welcome to the Meat Grinder, heros!"

 

Doc

[zippercomics]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

That's a pretty interesting question. If you've faced and defeated the Ultimate Evil, then all the rest of the "evil" must seem just bad, crappy. But hopefully (in a roleplaying sense, at least), said defeated evil can or will evolve as the heroes no doubt did just to get to that point.

 

That's about all I could offer on it. Ah, life, eh?

 

Ry

[Theron]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Wreck the world. Change things fundamentally. Maybe the sorts of techonology once available to a few becomes common. Perhaps a natural disaster no one anticipated hits before the PCs can react.

 

Change the dynamic of what it means to be a superhero. What does being superhuman mean when everyone can be superhuman? What does upholding the law mean if society falters or crumbles? What does all the power in the universe mean if the earth is dying from the inside and it's too late to reverse the disease?

[AngryBug]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

First, I hope you have/had at least an entire session as an Afterword; time to reflect, wrap up loose ends, etc. You could even spend a session or two with the characters , not the players, just dealing with "what now?". Then...?

End the campaign, start the sequel? "Champions: the Next Generation".

 

Failing that, Theron's idea's pretty good, make the campaign new by changing everything. It could even be a direct result of defeating said Ultimate Evil, a contingency plan they set in motion beforehand, like on Reboot when Megabyte engineered a system crash that went off just after his defeat.

 

If you don't want to wreck the world the team worked so hard to save, how about losing it instead? An encounter with "Dimensio, Master of Time and Space" turns the campaign into Sliders or Lost in Space for a while.

 

If the "same old, same old" has lost its spark, its time for a dramatic change of some sort.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

In the short term, the aftermath of a major confrontation is the time for change-of-pace stories: lighthearted humor, character development, confrontations and even threats of a more personal nature. The heros have earned the right to decompress a little, but don't overlook the consequences of having faced Ultimate Evil - this confrontation may have affected their relationships and world views, and you all can enjoy exploring that for a bit.

 

In the long term: What have been the consequences of the confrontation with the Ultimate Evil? Did your heroes simply face it and make it go "Poof?" Or have there been long-term consequences to its attack, something that will linger after it? Was there devastation around the Earth that mankind will remember, and if so, what will that do to their collective sense of security and stability? Are there factions prepared to take advantage of that? If the confrontation involved alien or mystical beings, how will that enhanced awareness of the breadth of the universe change the way people think? Will it impact philosopy, or religion?

 

Did the Ultimate Evil use minions, and did any of those minions survive? Will they want to seek revenge, and will they do so openly, or work long-term behind the scenes, perhaps establishing networks or allying with existing organizations? If they're refugees alien to this world, how will the human majority treat them?

 

Did the Ultimate Evil use advanced technology? Any of that tech left behind to be scavenged by superheroes or villains? By governments or criminal groups? How will the introduction of that technology impact society, the economy, the military?

 

Did the Ultimate Evil employ mystical forces, and are those forces now loose in the world to be exploited by adepts? Have those forces changed the laws of reality, the way the world works?

 

Depending on the degree of aftermath from this confrontation, this could be an opportunity for you and your players to take you campaign in fresh new directions.

[AngryBug]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Yeah, it was only after "The Best of Both Worlds" that ST:TNG got really good. I guess it depends on whether or not you want to continue as things were.

[Magmarock]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

You mean after they've defeated "This week's Ultimate evil", because there will always be someone to step up and fill the void.

 

If you don't believe me, just read a few comic books.

 

 

Mags

[Fireg0lem]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

So things continue to escalate? What happens when your heros realized that they've trapped themselves in a never-ending war against progressively tougher opponents.

 

"Welcome to the Meat Grinder, heros!"

 

Doc

 

Break out Dragonball Z Hero?

 

More seriously - things keep escalating, but not in the same direction. If the heroes were fighting off an alien invasion, maybe their next threat isn't something that straightforward but a government conspiracy to prevent the nearly all-powerful heroes from becoming too powerful. Maybe another group of heroes goes rogue - they weren't enemies before, but now they are.

 

Possibly, skip a few years of game time. Let the players change their characters a bit to reflect that - give them a block of XP to be spent on things they could have learned, and let them shuffle their disadvantages. Let the world develop & recover, change things around a bit - give the players the feeling that they've bought some peace and quiet for the world, even if doesn't last forever.

[Agemegos]

"Ultimate" means 'last'

 

Ok, you've formed a group of heros. You've met challenges. You've sprung back from defeat. You've grown in power and wisdom. Events have built to the point that you've had to deal with Ultimate Evil for the sake of all. You've prepared for it. You've faced it. You've won the day. And some of your number have actually survived.

 

Now what?

 

1. Recognise that your campaign has reached a triumphant conclusion.

 

2. Wrap up.

 

3. Start a new campaign in a different genre.

 

Any other approach leads to an anti-climax. If the ultimate evil turns out not to have been ultimate after all you will undermine all of what has passed to date, and your current feeling of triumph, closure, and dramatic catharsis will turn to ashes.

[FTJoshua]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Just want to say I like all those answers, and it was a good time to post them.

[GamePhil]

"Ultimate" means 'last'. Yes, last Evil. There's so much more.

 

1. Recognise that your campaign has reached a triumphant conclusion.

 

2. Wrap up.

 

3. Start a new campaign in a different genre.

 

Any other approach leads to an anti-climax. If the ultimate evil turns out not to have been ultimate after all you will undermine all of what has passed to date, and your current feeling of triumph, closure, and dramatic catharsis will turn to ashes.

 

Only if the entire point of the campaign is "fight Evil". Certainly, there are campaigns that this is true of (fairly typical of Superheroes, really, though they have the escalation "problem", and Epic Fantasy Quests), but it is not the only possibility. In other campaigns, it is quite possible that the players be interested in the aftermath, in building the new world once the evil is vanquished, in going out and gathering up the other Slayers....

 

Well, something like that.

[AngryBug]

Re: "Ultimate" means 'last'

 

 

Any other approach leads to an anti-climax. If the ultimate evil turns out not to have been ultimate after all you will undermine all of what has passed to date, and your current feeling of triumph, closure, and dramatic catharsis will turn to ashes.

 

Right, then the heroes all turn bitter and jaded and there you go- now you have an Iron Age campaign!

[DocMan]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Just want to say I like all those answers' date=' and it was a good time to post them. [/quote']

 

To be honest, it was your thread that inspired me to start this thread. I thought it was a good general question. Every successful campaign will eventually reach a point where they've just taken on the ultimate bad guy, and you've got to be able to move on from there.

 

Doc

[NecroBob]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

And lo before us lay the beast Armageddon dead.

Then upon us came a funny man in cape and mask

and to us he spoke,

"I am the great and powerful Fabulous Foxbat!"

Beset were we then by volley upon volley of ping pong balls....

 

Sometimes it's good to have the hero downtime by facing a few easy challenges then again... it all depends what your 'Ultimate' evil was in the campaign. Killing it will not necessarily be the final triumph of good over evil. There is the possibility of fallout from its destruction, in the form of lesser villians discovering and utilizing the thing's tech/magic/artifacts/power. Thus killing the ultimate only unleashed it's powers across the span of existance, spawning a whole new generation of evil and perhaps kindling the spark of the next great 'ultimate' evil.

 

There's also the fact of how do they know it really was the biggest fish in the pond? It's evil and annoying but it is a defenite possibility that there are even worse things out there than this evil.

[Doug McCrae]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Go to sleep under the ground. A centuries long sleep, to be awakened only when a great threat to the kingdom arises.

[GamePhil]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

And lo before us lay the beast Armageddon dead.

Then upon us came a funny man in cape and mask

and to us he spoke,

"I am the great and powerful Fabulous Foxbat!"

Beset were we then by volley upon volley of ping pong balls....

 

That was good. Thanks.

 

You mentioned "easy". I don't entirely agree that they need to be easier, necessarily, but different. There is nothing about Foxbat that says he has to be easy to beat, but his penchant for Master Plans means that, if it's a good one, it requires different thinking to beat than one of Dr. Destroyer's.

 

There's also the fact of how do they know it really was the biggest fish in the pond? It's evil and annoying but it is a defenite possibility that there are even worse things out there than this evil.

 

That tends to run into the "escalating villain" problem. This may not be a problem, of course, if that's what is desired. But if done too soon, it can detract from the great victory.

 

Still, there's a reason it's called the Neverending Battle.

[Enforcer84]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Ok, you've formed a group of heros. You've met challenges. You've sprung back from defeat. You've grown in power and wisdom. Events have built to the point that you've had to deal with Ultimate Evil for the sake of all. You've prepared for it. You've faced it. You've won the day. And some of your number have actually survived.

 

Now what?

 

How do you move on when you've faced the worst the Universe can throw at you and won? What does it mean for your campaign?

 

Doc

You face reality?

perhaps the heroes now find themselves doing the altruism thing. Disaster relief, looking into world hunger, political problems. Perhaps Evil wants a rematch. Only this time It won't rush headlong into confrontations. This time Evil plays it cool; holds off for a bit. Lets the heroes start to believe their press, then strikes from the shadows... etc.

 

or call it quits.

[Zed-F]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Premises:

1) Your characters have earned a respite from said evil.

2) There is now a power vacuum in the ranks of evil. Nature abhors a vacuum.

3) It will take some time for the ranks of evil to realign themselves according to a new order.

 

Answer:

The PCs get a nice "golden age" where evil in general is less prevalent and more hidden, and they are called upon less to fight it. There are still everyday occurrances, but these are handled in routine fashion. How much of this is played out as a denouement is up to you.

 

The campaign world ages 20+ years. Much changes. Evil begins to rear its head again, with new faces in high places, as well as some old ones. The heroes have gone largely untested, unchallenged in this time. Have they retired? Have they lost their edge? Have they moved on?

[zornwil]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

The real ultimate evil is the campaign-ender for me. But I never got there with the prior campaign, though we were getting close. This campaign has a confluence of factors now coming together as the "near-term-ultimate" story-line after which I intend to rest the campaign for a while, though I haven't really discussed it with the players for 2 reasons:

 

1 - that's my current perception of things: they may totally derail it!

2 - this will take a while so before we get close enough there'll be opportunity for discussion and tuning per that

 

So we'll just see. As to the interim "ultimate evils" which form the story arcs, as LL mentions, it's a change of pace after that, although I pretty immediately plant (or more accurately grow as they are already there) the seeds for the next "big bad".

[Nuadha]

Re: "Ultimate" means 'last'. Yes, last Evil. There's so much more.

 

In other campaigns' date=' it is quite possible that the players be interested in the aftermath, in building the new world once the evil is vanquished, in going out and gathering up the other Slayers....[/quote']

 

 

When I read the title of this thread, I thought immediately of Buffy. I'm running a Buffy RPG campaign with new original characters set after Buffy season seven. Since Buffy defeated "the first evil" in that episode, I've been dealing with the difficulty of designing adventures that have enough personal connection for the PCs, since I knew that any ultimate evil I create for the PCs to go against, would just be a pale shadow of the evils Buffy and gang faced. My PCs are having to deal with their season one big bads in a world where they know all about what Buffy faced in Sunnydale's later seasons.

[ZootSoot]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Feh, if all your campaign is about is fighting ever more powerful foes then it is time to kill it and start again. Otherwise, well there should be some serious dramatic, role-playing resources built up here and they should be explored for a time until a new (or returned) ultimate evil starts making ripples in your world. Think about the defeat of the "ultimate" evil being like the end of a BTVS season, you've beaten the guy who was behind all that crap that made your lives difficult but next fall a new mastermind will start to plague you (and not necessarily one that is more powerful or more evil, just different).

 

I always liked the quote from Ironclad about Blowtorch(?) in which he says how people are always calling Takofanes or Dark Seraph the ultimate evil, but then if you do that what then do you call a man who enjoys setting children on fire just to hear them scream. Sadly, evil comes in a number of different flavos, it may be time to try the butterriple now that you have grown tired of vanilla.

[Mentor]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Sometimes all you need is a change of scenery.

 

 

"Heroes assembled. The Zeboidian ambassador's final words after her extrication from the wreckage of her Diplomatic transport were a dire warning to the Earth.

 

Ravager World fleets will embark for Earth in just one of our years and obliterate humanity unless someone can preempt their launch. They have a secret base somewhere in the Gl'rst Cluster guarded by Superions and their multidimensional energy hounds. If only a force of sufficient might can be mobilized in the short time required, we have enough energy in the Zeboidian hyper portal to transport a team once and quickly. There is a further catch. This council doesn't know how the team will return unless they luck upon a sufficiently advanced alien technology."

 

"Not to worry Professor Quest. Midguard is ready willing and able. When do we leave?"

 

"We knew we could count on you, Cyberknight"

 

"Hello, Papa. I'm gonna be out of touch for a while. Yah, Mongolia to investigate that meteor crash. Yah, you know how secretive the Chinese can be. I'll call you when we get back. OK. Dasvidanya, Papa."

 

 

An extended space adventure is just the ticket to give Earthbound supers a fresh feel and new set of challenges.

[AngryBug]

Re: After the Ultimate Evil... what?

 

Ok, you've formed a group of heros. You've met challenges. You've sprung back from defeat. You've grown in power and wisdom. Events have built to the point that you've had to deal with Ultimate Evil for the sake of all. You've prepared for it. You've faced it. You've won the day. And some of your number have actually survived.

 

Now what?

 

 

 

"I'm going to Disneyland!!"