CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

[Steve Long]

I sent CP off to layout yesterday, so it's time for another WDYWTS thread. Now in the batter's box: the new Champions Universe supplement!

 

As y'all know, CU is our comprehensive guide to the amazing Champions Universe. It's going to follow the same basic pattern as the 5E edition:

 

Chapter One: history, from the earliest days up to 2010 (though obviously the majority of the text is devoted to the 1938-2010 period).

 

Chapter Two: a short one discussing the definition of "superhuman" for this setting.

 

Chapter Three: Superhumans And Society -- how they interact with the government, the media, technology, various subcultures (Business World, Martial World, Scientific World...).

 

Chapter Four: The CU Multiverse -- superhumans around the world; Millennium City; Vibora Bay; the various Hidden Lands; outer space and alien life; other dimensions.

 

Chapter Five: A brief but helpful review of the major players in the CU -- the main villains, the major organizations, the most prominent NPC heroes, et cetera.

 

Chapter Six: GMing; also includes the "GM's Vault" wherein we put the *real* information that's not revealed in Chapters 1-5 (thus in theory allowing players to read the book without spoiling plots or giving away setting secrets).

 

 

But, that being said, the 5E CU book was pretty slim compared to some of our later books -- 160 pages (albeit very meaty pages!). Since I now have seven years' worth of supplements to draw on as well as all of Cryptic's changes/additions, I expect this version to end up a larger book... possibly *much* larger, though I don't intend to go nuts. I've got enough work to do without making more for myself.

 

Before anyone asks -- as currently planned, this will be a hardover, full-color book.

 

So, keeping in mind that there will be refinements and expansions of what you see in the existing CU book... what would you like to see in the new CU?

[GestaltBennie]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

A couple of things spring to my mind off the bat based on some CO channel discussions.

 

First, a small section on the relationship between events in the real world and CU would be nice. You don't have to *say* "9/11 happened, there's a war in Afghanistan, etc.", but people need to know how close the worlds are to draw on real life events and whether they can work it into their background stories.

 

Second, having been embroiled in arguments on whether people can make analogies to Superman, the Flash and other fictional properties, I'd suggest amending the comic book section so it's clear that major fctional comic book characters are well-known in pop culture (and that references are acceptable, even if copyright infingement isn't. ))

 

More when I see issues arise.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Likewise, only a couple of things come to my mind.

 

1) In either Chapter One or (more likely) its GM's Vault section, a text box listing some of the other periods of the Hero Universe's overall timeline, from the Turakian Age right up to the era of the Galactic Champions.

 

2) Some tips on running "themed" hero groups such as the X-Men, or Allen Varney's Mystic Masters -- all mutants, all high-tech heroes, all magical heroes, all monster-hunters, all enemies of organized crime, and other ideas. There's probably something on this in the Champions book (which I haven't seen yet), but specifics for CU players could help nail this down. You could even list some of the likely villains for various themes (though that might be a better choice for the Villains books themselves).

 

3) A mention of Seeker. (Yeah, he's a comic book character... the 5E reference is just fine.)

 

I'll probably have more ideas later, but that's what comes right to mind.

[gojira]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Chapter Five: A brief but helpful review of the major players in the CU -- the main villains, the major organizations, the most prominent NPC heroes, et cetera.

 

 

This is one of the main areas where I might want to kibitz. Who from Champions Online should get detailed write-ups? But to know that I'd need to know who has already been written up in Champions. Can we get a list of the latter? And a list of who you think you might give full character write-ups to in CU, just to get us started?

 

Of the top of my head, I think any of the contacts or trainers from CO would be fun to see in CU. E.g.: Mayte Sanchez and Dr. Silverback.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Of the top of my head' date=' I think any of the contacts or trainers from CO would be fun to see in CU. E.g.: Mayte Sanchez and Dr. Silverback.[/quote']Hey, that's a very good idea! A list of notable people who could be listed as Contacts for various purposes, and what they're worth in terms of what they can do in that context (that is, whether they have Very Useful resources and the like), would be a great help.

[Steve Long]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

First, a small section on the relationship between events in the real world and CU would be nice. You don't have to *say* "9/11 happened, there's a war in Afghanistan, etc.", but people need to know how close the worlds are to draw on real life events and whether they can work it into their background stories.

 

I've been planning to put in a sidebar saying something like, "Unless we say it changed at some point, anything that happened in real life should be assumed to have happened in the CU." That's about as far as I want to go; trivializing tragedies like 9/11 and whatnot by putting them in gaming books doesn't sit right with me. Nor do I particularly like to touch on politically-charged topics and thereby somehow alienate 50-100% of the audience.

 

 

Second, having been embroiled in arguments on whether people can make analogies to Superman, the Flash and other fictional properties, I'd suggest amending the comic book section so it's clear that major fctional comic book characters are well-known in pop culture (and that references are acceptable, even if copyright infingement isn't.

 

LOL. OK, here I draw the line. If someone's going to argue about things like that he can do it on his own without any help from li'l ol' me.

[Steve Long]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

And a list of who you think you might give full character write-ups to in CU, just to get us started?

 

Champions itself features the five members of the Champions as starting 400-point heroes, and six villains.

 

My current plans for CU are to present character sheets for the five members of the Champions as of 2010 (i.e., with 10 years of experience under their belts, so probably 600-pointers or so), plus some or all of the following NPC heroes: the All-American; Black Mask X; Gadget Boy; Mayte Sanchez; Dr. Silverback; Victory. That's the most I intend to put in, and there's a good chance I won't even put in all of those guys. There's only so much need for NPC heroes.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I would like to see very few to preferably no character sheets included in this book, particularly of villains. Now that supervillains from across the setting are being compiled in the various "Villains" supplements, it would only be redundant to include any in this volume, and that would leave room for more textual info. Sidebars with brief notes and stats for prominent non-super NPCs, as with the 5E sourcebook, are fine and helpful.

 

However, I could understand if some NPC heroes from the setting need to be included again (unless you're considering doing an "Allies" book just for them, or putting them in the city sourcebooks). If you deem that some character sheets must be included, please put them all in the GM's Vault section, rather than scattered through the book as previously. We might want to surprise our players with them.

 

I have to question whether any reference to Hudson City and Dark Champions continuity should be included in the 6E CU. I know you like to have everything be part of one coherent setting, but Hudson City is such a completely different kettle of fish in content and tone from the rest of the superhero world, and has so little connection to it, that IMHO it's just confusing to try to integrate it.

 

In either Chapter One or (more likely) its GM's Vault section' date=' a text box listing some of the other periods of the Hero Universe's overall timeline, from the Turakian Age right up to the era of the Galactic Champions.[/quote']

 

Assuming all these eras are still part of Champions Universe continuity, and there's no copyright issue with Cryptic Studios in mentioning them here, I'd prefer to see major events from these other eras mentioned in the overall timeline, at least briefly. They often have a direct impact on several elements of the supers setting, and would help new people understand the full scope of the CU.

[kahuna's bro]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

This is one of the main areas where I might want to kibitz. Who from Champions Online should get detailed write-ups? But to know that I'd need to know who has already been written up in Champions. Can we get a list of the latter? And a list of who you think you might give full character write-ups to in CU, just to get us started?

 

Of the top of my head, I think any of the contacts or trainers from CO would be fun to see in CU. E.g.: Mayte Sanchez and Dr. Silverback.

i suggest johnny hercules

[Steve]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Champions itself features the five members of the Champions as starting 400-point heroes, and six villains.

 

My current plans for CU are to present character sheets for the five members of the Champions as of 2010 (i.e., with 10 years of experience under their belts, so probably 600-pointers or so), plus some or all of the following NPC heroes: the All-American; Black Mask X; Gadget Boy; Mayte Sanchez; Dr. Silverback; Victory. That's the most I intend to put in, and there's a good chance I won't even put in all of those guys. There's only so much need for NPC heroes.

 

One thing I'd be curious about is what the Champions superteam looks like if built using translated CO powers.

[Steve]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Hey' date=' that's a very good idea! A list of notable people who could be listed as Contacts for various purposes, and what they're worth in terms of what they can do in that context (that is, whether they have Very Useful resources and the like), would be a great help.[/quote']

 

This would be a useful addition and fun too.

[Steve Long]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

One thing I'd be curious about is what the Champions superteam looks like if built using translated CO powers.

 

They're not, so you'll have to remain curious. If I built all the NPC heroes and villains to copy their in-MMO versions, they'd all look too alike. Cryptic's happy to let us flex our system creativity and do 'em up in a little more variety.

[Steve Long]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I would like to see very few to preferably no character sheets included in this book, particularly of villains.

 

This is more or less what I'm planning on doing, though we'll see how far I want to take this particular philosophy.

[RexMundi]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I want, Blockhead.

 

~Rex

[Blue]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I want, Blockhead.

 

~Rex

You rang?

 

Oh... you meant...

 

Anyway, I was wondering if any CO storylines will be incorporated into Champions Universe.

[Peregrine]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Champions itself features the five members of the Champions as starting 400-point heroes, and six villains.

 

My current plans for CU are to present character sheets for the five members of the Champions as of 2010 (i.e., with 10 years of experience under their belts, so probably 600-pointers or so), plus some or all of the following NPC heroes: the All-American; Black Mask X; Gadget Boy; Mayte Sanchez; Dr. Silverback; Victory. That's the most I intend to put in, and there's a good chance I won't even put in all of those guys. There's only so much need for NPC heroes.

 

Going off of the inclusion of the All-American, I'd like to see more about the super-soldier and superhuman soldier programs of the CU. In 5e, the U.S. had one of each (Perseus and Cyberline, respectively) operative, active, and routinely usable (within parameters of subject compatibility), with two others "retired" (Achilles and Yeoman) and one producing inconsistent results (Janissary). Have other CU nations developed anything comparable? How has the U.S. used its programs (especially the successful ones, Cyberline and Perseus) outside of PRIMUS, the All-American program, and the original Ameriforce One, if at all?

[assault]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

3) A mention of Seeker. (Yeah' date=' he's a comic book character... the 5E reference is just fine.)[/quote']

 

I agree. The legend of Seeker must continue!

[PhantomGM2602]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

What about focusing on teen hero groups like NOVA and the Arcadian academy and maybe an aticle on creating training facilities for teen and 'tween super heroes?

[BobGreenwade]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I want' date=' Blockhead.[/quote']

You rang?

 

Oh... you meant...

Actually, I was kind of wondering whether the comma was intentional -- it does make a difference!

[Steve Long]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I was wondering if any CO storylines will be incorporated into Champions Universe.

 

Well, I'm planning to include the Qularr invasion, Stronghold breakout, and Blood Moon incidents in the timeline for 2009, if that's what you mean.

[Hugh Neilson]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

ASecond' date=' having been embroiled in arguments on whether people can make analogies to Superman, the Flash and other fictional properties, I'd suggest amending the comic book section so it's clear that major fctional comic book characters are well-known in pop culture (and that references are acceptable, even if copyright infingement isn't. ))[/quote']

 

LOL. OK' date=' here I draw the line. If someone's going to argue about things like that he can do it on his own without any help from li'l ol' me. [/quote']

 

Awwww.... Personally, I always liked the Watchmen take that, due to the advent of "real" superheroes, comic book Supers were just a flash in the pan, and comic feature primarily pirate stories. Marvel's approach of comics (often licensed) of real Supers was an interesting approach. I'd like to see a reference (probably no more than a sidebar) of where comics went in the CU.

 

As to characters, I like the idea of the major NPC heroes (you'll be fighting them when on an alternate EvilVerse, framed for a crime or when one or the other is mind controlled anyway). The villains will get lots of play in the Villains books, so no need to do anything more than reference them here and whet our appetites for those upcoming volumes, right?

[Steve Long]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

so no need to do anything more than reference them here and whet our appetites for those upcoming volumes, right?

 

Well, that's Step 5-A in my Fiendish Master Plan, yes.

[Sketchpad]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Rather than listing the various super-trainers and such, I'd rather have info on agencies (Primus, UNTIL, etc) and significant NPCs attached to them (ie Golden Avenger, Silver Avengers, etc).

 

As far as the events in CO, any chance we could see those as PDF adventures?

[The Main Man]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

While I would imagine that there is at least some level of reboot, I think that quite a bit of Champions: News of the World could be assimilated to what was already there in the 5e Champions Universe book.

 

That sounds like a decent starting point as any to me.

=======================

 

I would also think that information from all of the various releases since Champions Universe could be good for adding a little more detail to the overall book, if only in an introductory sense (gotta sell more books of course).

 

What I mean by this is that, say, the intro to the hidden lands in CU, while meant to be a brief introduction ,it still feels rather "rough draftish" by comparison to the eventual Hidden Lands book itself.

 

I think that this new book could have better introductive summaries of books like VIPER, DEMON, UNTIL, Champions Worldwide, Stronghold, Cops, Crews, & Cabals, The Mystic World, etc than the original one did now that said books have been released.

[The Main Man]

Re: CHAMPIONS UNIVERSE: What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Awwww.... Personally, I always liked the Watchmen take that, due to the advent of "real" superheroes, comic book Supers were just a flash in the pan, and comic feature primarily pirate stories. Marvel's approach of comics (often licensed) of real Supers was an interesting approach. I'd like to see a reference (probably no more than a sidebar) of where comics went in the CU.

 

As to characters, I like the idea of the major NPC heroes (you'll be fighting them when on an alternate EvilVerse, framed for a crime or when one or the other is mind controlled anyway). The villains will get lots of play in the Villains books, so no need to do anything more than reference them here and whet our appetites for those upcoming volumes, right?

 

Here's a thought: what if the pulps translated over to comic books but they never really quite reached superheroic storytelling? This could give the common man a sense of adventure that they can relate to when they read in a world of supers.

 

Just a thought though.