Ragitsu Posted February 2, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Just wait: some author will find a way to make a joined-planet world . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted February 2, 2010 Report Share Posted February 2, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Bring on, Marvel's Microverse. ~Rex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assault Posted February 2, 2010 Report Share Posted February 2, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? a) If you're going to cite something as realistic' date=' you'd do yourself a favor by picking something other than a cheesy Lego-based comic strip. [/quote'] The guy who does Irregular Webcomic is an astrophysicist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assault Posted February 2, 2010 Report Share Posted February 2, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Another possible way to have a "single climate" world: artificial habitats. Basically, most of the world is uninhabited/uninhabitable, but there is a large artificial habitat present. In practical terms, the habitat is "the world" - it's the only place to go that isn't basically vacuum and desert. Come to think of it, the habitat doesn't have to be that large - it could just be a smallish base. The point is that there isn't anywhere else to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSgt Baloo Posted February 2, 2010 Report Share Posted February 2, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? The point is that there isn't anywhere else to go. That sounds like a lot of the places I was stationed. Noplace to go, nothing to do. Except for the vaccuum part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawnmower Boy Posted February 2, 2010 Report Share Posted February 2, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? But I'm sure they still sucked. Someone should pay me for making the Internet a better place, so I don't have to go to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? So' date=' to review: 100 million square kilometresx50,000 people/square kilometres= 50 trillion people.[/quote'] That's several orders of magnitude greater than the world population we've been discussing. The guy who does Irregular Webcomic is an astrophysicist. Sure, but when you're linking to scientific information, a Lego-based webcomic probably isn't the image of credibility you're looking for. If the guy has the calcs written out somewhere, link to those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristopher Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? That's several orders of magnitude greater than the world population we've been discussing. Some of the numbers we've been throwing around were in the 1 - 5 trillion range, based on either the land surface area or Earth or the given land area of Trantor, and the population density of some notable cities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Obvious Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Hmm...looking around, it seems that Trantor's canonical population density is about 600/square kilometer. That's about the same as Germany (as a whole...density is obviously higher in the cities). If the whole planet is covered in city as described, there's a lot of room that's not being actively occupied by humans at any given time. I expect a good portion of that is landing fields for the spacecraft bringing in all the food etc that they need to import, but most of it is probably just warehouses of computer memory, full of census data and tax statements for thousands of years and trillions of people in the Galactic Empire. I won't try to make sense of anything Lucas says. If he says the sky on one of his planets is blue, I'll assume it's because of midichlorians or something...it's obviously not because of the way oxygen refracts light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Some of the numbers we've been throwing around were in the 1 - 5 trillion range' date=' based on either the land surface area or Earth or the given land area of Trantor, and the population density of some notable cities.[/quote'] I thought we were talking about 40 billion earlier. Hmm...looking around, it seems that Trantor's canonical population density is about 600/square kilometer. That's about the same as Germany (as a whole...density is obviously higher in the cities). If the whole planet is covered in city as described, there's a lot of room that's not being actively occupied by humans at any given time. I expect a good portion of that is landing fields for the spacecraft bringing in all the food etc that they need to import, but most of it is probably just warehouses of computer memory, full of census data and tax statements for thousands of years and trillions of people in the Galactic Empire. I won't try to make sense of anything Lucas says. If he says the sky on one of his planets is blue, I'll assume it's because of midichlorians or something...it's obviously not because of the way oxygen refracts light. I'm sure Lucas didn't put a lot of thought into it because that's not how Star Wars works (and criticizing it by slinging numbers makes about as much sense as criticizing a Bugs Bunny cartoon with physics). But yeah, a planetwide city doesn't mean a planetwide city center. Cities generally have more way low-density than high-density areas and no shortage of zero-density areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristopher Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? I thought we were talking about 40 billion earlier. I'm sure Lucas didn't put a lot of thought into it because that's not how Star Wars works (and criticizing it by slinging numbers makes about as much sense as criticizing a Bugs Bunny cartoon with physics). But yeah, a planetwide city doesn't mean a planetwide city center. Cities generally have more way low-density than high-density areas and no shortage of zero-density areas. 40 billion was used, I don't recall where it came from, it might be the canonical population of Trantor. But if it is, Trantor isn't really "one vast city" -- just not enough people. Keep in mind that the density figures I was trying out to get numbers in the few trillions rage are from real cities, which include things like airports and warehouses and parks and various non-residental buildings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted February 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Yes, but just consider how packed the poorer sections must be: more than enough to balance out any sparsely populated areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markdoc Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? I think canon for Trantor is 40 billion - that's a lot, but spaced out over the land mass of an earth-sized planet (Trantor still has oceans), means there's still plenty of empty space: that's about the same population density as the UK. However, I think it was suggested that a population of 1 trillion is more realistic. As for the heat pump comment, I am assuming that Trantor had, at one point, a climate and we know it has oceans - I assume that any civilization that can build a world spanning city can also build a world-spanning piping system: I'm sitting here looking out the window at snow and sub-zero temperatures - in a room heated entirely by waste heat. cheers, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted February 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Why aren't we using Coruscant figures? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristopher Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Why aren't we using Coruscant figures? The thread isn't actually about Coruscant, or even just about city-worlds in general. But we can always toss those numbers around, too. What's the given population and land surface area of Corruscant? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Yes' date=' but just consider how packed the poorer sections must be: more than enough to balance out any sparsely populated areas.[/quote'] How so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? An alternate way to look at it would be, if the Earth was covered by "jungle" what would it look like? What could you do to areas like Antarctica or the Sahara such that you could plausibly call them "jungles?" Solve that and you have a planetwide jungle, though obviously it won't be the same jungle everywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted February 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Then there's the little issue of entertainment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Man Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Catgirls go with just about any environment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucius Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Catgirls go with just about any environment. Jungle - tiger girl Desert - lion girl Arctic - snow leopard girl Aquatic - catfish girl Vacuum - cat girl in a spacesuit Gas giant - ??? Lucius Alexander Palindromedary Enterprises - we sell more than just palindromedaries! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clonus Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? On other occasions I've pointed out that the illusion of a single climate world can be created simply by noting that people who have space ships rarely travel more than a few miles away from where they touched ground. Thus it seems like it was raining on Mongo that afternoon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Mackinder Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? On other occasions I've pointed out that the illusion of a single climate world can be created simply by noting that people who have space ships rarely travel more than a few miles away from where they touched ground. Thus it seems like it was raining on Mongo that afternoon. Rainy days on Mongo always get me down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancer Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? The guy who does Irregular Webcomic is an astrophysicist. Obviously he's an undependable ignoramus who knows nothing about special relativity, planet formation, or the Fermi paradox then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
austenandrews Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? Me-ow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragitsu Posted February 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Re: Are single climate/habitat worlds really possible? I still don't know what Mongo is. I feel so pop culturally ignorant . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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