Nightfire Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 I was wondering does anyone know why Anais was changed from a male fraternal twins in Arcane Adversaries to a female in twin in Champions Villains vol2. I thought it was bold move on Hero Games' part to not only feature two gay characters but to have them as villains and incestuous to boot. To change Anais to a woman is a step in the wrong direction, having the unfortunate implication that gay characters can not be presented while maintaining the much more controversial incestuous relationship. I was just wondering others thoughts on the matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. MID-Nite Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins I was wondering does anyone know why Anais was changed from a male fraternal twins in Arcane Adversaries to a female in twin in Champions Villains vol2. I thought it was bold move on Hero Games' part to not only feature two gay characters but to have them as villains and incestuous to boot. To change Anais to a woman is a step in the wrong direction' date=' having the unfortunate implication that gay characters can not be presented while maintaining the much more controversial incestuous relationship. I was just wondering others thoughts on the matter.[/quote'] Heh...don't even get started on this. I asked this several years ago when Arcane Adversaries first released. Apparently, they've always been a male/female pair(as seen in Mystic Masters 4th Edition). The story is the artist got the description without much detail into their background, assumed they were incestuous identical twins(not entirely implausible), and drew the picture you see in that book. For the record, they were vastly more interesting as incestuous identical twins if you ask me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermit Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Anais was actually female originally in the 4th Edition IIRC. The 'change' to male in Arcane Adversaries was actually ONLY in the art. I don't recall the whole story, but the artist apparently assumed 'twins = identical twins" and, not being familiar with French names, thought both were male. EDIT: Looks like Dr. Mid-Nite beat me to the explaination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. MID-Nite Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Anais was actually female originally in the 4th Edition IIRC. The 'change' to male in Arcane Adversaries was actually ONLY in the art. I don't recall the whole story, but the artist apparently assumed 'twins = identical twins" and, not being familiar with French names, thought both were male. EDIT: Looks like Dr. Mid-Nite beat me to the explaination. Considering the stir it caused when I originally commended DOJ for having gay supervillains in a supplement, I was quickly corrected by Steve Long himself. I didn't think it was such a big deal at the time...and honestly...they're WAY more boring as fraternal twins. I've always used them as identical twins since Arcane Enemies...LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Well, you can give the DOJ-era Hero Games at least a little credit for progressiveness. In their original 4E Mystic Masters incarnation they weren't even twins. They had different mothers, having only their father, the randy Adrian Vandaleur, in common. And in that version Eduard Vandaleur was Edward, from an aristocratic English branch of the family. Mind you, having a male raised in a French-speaking country with the name "Anais" might help explain how he turned out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQuestionMan Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Both were written by different authors and Its needed to more PC due to its publication. Ask Steve, but I will never use them either way. Not my style of characters. QM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Now if you want bold, you should check out the Clone Mob in the Star HERO supplement, Scourges Of The Galaxy. These guys are also villains, and their relationships aren't just gay and incestuous, they're narcissistic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix240 Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins O.O Wow, I never heard of these characters before. That's pretty edgy stuff for Champions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Anais was never male. She's been female since the day she was created. The problem was that the artist who drew the twins for Arcane Adversaries somehow didn't know/realize that Anais is a girl's name. By the time the art came in it was too late to change things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightfire Posted June 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Thank you, I had never known there was a fourth edition version of Arcane Adversaries, or thor Anais was a girl's name. My curiosity has been sated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brionl Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins My curiosity has been sated. In the context of this thread, "Eww, TMI!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightfire Posted June 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins In the context of this thread' date=' "Eww, TMI!"[/quote'] LOL. I'd never actually uses the twins no matter what their composition. I only read the articles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinecone Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins LOL. I'd never actually uses the twins no matter what their composition. I only read the articles I always planned on using them as both females...what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Long Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Thank you, I had never known there was a fourth edition version of Arcane Adversaries, or thor Anais was a girl's name. My curiosity has been sated. Just to be clear, there was never a 4E version of Arcane Adversaries -- it's a 5E book. The Vandaleur twins originally appeared in a 4E supplement called Mystic Masters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Certified Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins So while we're on the topic, what are the chances of seeing a gay couple, heroes or villains pop up in Champions Universe cannon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brionl Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Since the sexual orientation, spouse and/or significant other isn't mentioned for most NPCs, what makes you think some of them aren't? Unless you're asking for something like Gayman! The Gayest Superhero Ever! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Since the sexual orientation' date=' spouse and/or significant other isn't mentioned for most NPCs, what makes you think some of them aren't? Unless you're asking for something like Gayman! The Gayest Superhero Ever![/quote'] And his (entirely platonic) team mate: Lesbia. Sounds like a good new chalenge for here: http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php/80447-Create-a-Hero-Theme-Team! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt the Bruins Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins I've always thought Bulldozer was overcompensating for something... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnia Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins I've always thought Bulldozer was overcompensating for something... Nah. Bulldozer is just a [bleeper]. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix240 Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins I've always thought Bulldozer was overcompensating for something... His most recent illustration seems to back that up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. MID-Nite Posted June 12, 2011 Report Share Posted June 12, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins So while we're on the topic' date=' what are the chances of seeing a gay couple, heroes or villains pop up in Champions Universe cannon?[/quote'] A gay character shows up in 5th ed Cops, Crews, and Cabals as one of the MCPD's superhuman response unit members. There's probably a large numbers of characters from the current CU that COULD be gay, but it's never been brought up. That'd be for the GM to decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightfire Posted June 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins That's true it is always up to the GM, although since many heroes, villains and the like are "canon" straight, it would be nice if a few were also by canon, not straight. After all it seems being open minded (or perhaps progressive might be a better word) has helped Bioware's bottom line (Dragons Age) why not true RPGs? It doesn't have to be everyone, just a character who actually isn't "open to interpretation" but definitively gay preferably without stereotypes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher Posted June 12, 2011 Report Share Posted June 12, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins That's true it is always up to the GM' date=' although since many heroes, villains and the like are "canon" straight, it would be nice if a few were also by canon, not straight. After all it seems being open minded (or perhaps progressive might be a better word) has helped Bioware's bottom line (Dragons Age) why not true RPGs? It doesn't have to be everyone, just a character who actually isn't "open to interpretation" but definitively gay preferably without stereotypes.[/quote'] There are other orientations to consider (aside from the straight/homosexual for both genders): Asexual "Not Interpescies interested" (for those "nearly human aliens"), but very interesting for humans "Not biophiliac" for Robots/Undead/Androids By the way, what are the chances that Sex and Sorcery has something about it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix240 Posted June 12, 2011 Report Share Posted June 12, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins Comics are such a wide open genre that there are almost endless possibiliities when it comes to relationships, sex and sexuality. It';s an incredibly difficult and touchy subject for most people though with a huge range of opinion on what's appropriate or not. The writers are probably doing the right thing by keeping it understated and leaving allot of that context up to individual GMs and groups. That said though, I don't thnk some openly homosexual or bisexual characters would really by that contraversial in this day and age. It would also be a nod towards diversity and inclusion. As long as their creators remeber to make them interesting charcters with more to them besides their orientation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawnmower Boy Posted June 12, 2011 Report Share Posted June 12, 2011 Re: Vandaleur Twins The question of whether including gay characters in the Champions Universe would be controversial or not is moot. There are plenty of them already, including Canada's most currently prominent flag suit, Justiciar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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