Luck...

[Jazzidemus]

Quick question, in general how often do you, personally use/ roll Luck/ Unluck in your games? 

[eepjr24]

I use Killer Shrikes method for my MHI games. 

 

http://www.killershrike.com/HereThereBeMonsters/Paradigm_Abilities_Talents.aspx

[Jazzidemus]

It reads well how is it in execution?

[Dr. MID-Nite]

I usually roll once at the beginning of the session...to see if it has any impact on the general story/noncombat activity and once in each combat. That's usually enough.

[archer]

In general, I like the philosophy that the more lucky you are, in number of dice, the more often you should have the chance to be lucky.

 

Of course, using that philosophy, no one should ever choose to be very unlucky.

[Lucius]

 

It depends. Sometimes several times a session.

 

I also give player characters 2 "free dice" of Luck and of Unluck in addition to any they take deliberately.

 

I also distribute "Fortune Points" when I make a player take an Unluck roll, and points can be spent for a Luck roll or for several other benefits. One of the functions of Fortune points is to ensure characters get a little more good fortune than they do ill fortune.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary explains that good fortune outweighs bad because players get a certain number of points just for showing up.

[BoloOfEarth]

One of the PCs is a mage with a spell that gives up to 8 people 5d6 Luck for several minutes, so it mainly gets cast at the start of practically every combat for him and his teammates.  To give it a tangible effect, we decided to have them roll the Luck dice and count BODY - and that total they could spend to add to to-hit and/or skill rolls.  And any "6" rolled also gave them a re-roll for any to-hit or skill roll. 

[Jazzidemus]

I like the idea of your Luck Dice being a pool for rolls & what not. The rules were always kind of vague on how it effects game play. I know it was meant to be more of a GM tool, but with Killer Shrikes method it seems a bit more active.

[Tech]

During the course of an game episode, if the need for someone to make a roll, I grant the person with Luck to automatically make it. How I use Luck varies. I rarely have people roll Luck anymore because 2d6 of Luck is 10 points of uncertainty; I could easily use the points for 10 points of certain Defense or Stun or... etc. Another way I handle it is if a hero needs a break and an attack roll is supposed to hit, the attack misses because "of a lucky break". There's too many ways to describe how I use it but those are a couple ways I use Luck.

 

For Unluck, I use it more for humor than to hurt the character. Of course, if they have Unluck, I might allow an attack that should've missed to hit them. I use it more for "Btw, you realize while you're in public that you forgot to shave or comb your hair" or something like that such as, "Your next door neighbor's gate is open - the neighbor who's dog hates you."

[RDU Neil]

Luck comes up a lot, but I have a major house/bennie rule tied to it. Even the more classic Luck Roll is a thing, when it comes to "is there/isn't there?" moments that come up. 

 

"I punch the accelerator and floor it through the red light, so I don't lose the escaping bad guy!"  "Roll a luck roll... good luck, you make it through no problems, neutral you'll need a driving check to avoid cross traffic and get through. Bad luck, you get t-boned!"

 

that kind of thing.  Used when a judgment call from the GM really is more of a random chance... and only when that random is dramatically important. 

[Jazzidemus]

I thought about using Bennies, 1 Bennie per d6 at the start of the game. Use a Bennie for a dodge opportunity or what not, perhaps a re-roll on a missed skill or ability check, but not damage. 

[RDU Neil]

10 minutes ago, Jazzidemus said:

I thought about using Bennies, 1 Bennie per d6 at the start of the game. Use a Bennie for a dodge opportunity or what not, perhaps a re-roll on a missed skill or ability check, but not damage. 

 

Here are my Luck Chit rules... will seem like a lot of text, but in play, it is quick and dramatic... toss a chit for a certain effect.

 

--

 

Luck & Luck Chits 

Luck cost 5 pts per level. (Price doubles for each 3 levels bought (so fourth level of Luck costs 10 points) For each level of Luck purchased, players gain: 

• 1d6 of Luck to add to a Luck Roll that can only have positive results. 

• They randomly draw +1 Luck Chit at the beginning of the game from “the bag.” 

------ 

Luck Chit Rules 

Each PC draws one Luck Chit from “the bag” +1 Chit for every level of Luck at the beginning of the game.  “The bag” contains 72 Chits in the following assortment:  30 White Chits, 20 Black Chits, 20 Blue Chits, 1 Red Chit, 1 Gold Chit.  A player may decide to “throw a chit” at any point during play where they think it will benefit them, the group or the story to do so.  The chits provide the following benefits in play. 

• White Chits:  Lowest rank.  Using a white chit allows ONE of the following by choice of the player: 

• Re-roll one roll you control 

• Take an Abort Action at any time without cost of a regular Action. 

• Take a Recovery at any time without cost of a regular Action or any defensive penalties. 

• Defensively move a Hit Location result one level up or down on the HL chart. (Only used in Heroic games where Hit Location is used.)

• Black Chits: Middle rank.  Using a black chit allows ONE of the following by choice of the player: * 

• Any one of the benefits as listed under White Chits. (see above) 

• Any one benefit as listed under Blue Chits. (see below)

• BUT...Throwing a black chit allows the GM to draw a chit to add to his/her pool of NPC/Villain chits. 

• Blue Chits: High rank.  Using a blue chit allows ONE of the following by choice of the player. 

• Any one of the benefits of the White chits as listed above.

• May remove a single die from a 3d6 roll you control, to maximize chance of success/hit. (Making the roll a "3" or less does not activate a critical hit.) 

• Power Stunt:  Player may choose to utilize active points of a power of their character for an effect not specifically paid for with points, but within the SFX of the power.  Ex:  A character with an EB defined as “flame blast” wishes to extinguish a fire in a doorway blocking escape for civilians. The character does not have a power that would normally allow him to do this, but by throwing a blue chit, for one action, he can put the active points of the EB into Change Environment: Extinguish/Reduce Normal Fires (or something similar) and the player can then perform the desired action. 

• Minor Scene Change:  Player may choose to alter or set a small piece of the scene for character or story advantage.  Ex.  “There is a pack of dry matches in the old hunting shack. Just what I need to light my torch to fight the vampire!” or “As I fly in, I see an open skylight allowing me access to the building without breaking in!”   GM and group agreement on what is appropriate necessary. 

• Make the impossible, possible:  Player may throw a blue chit to turn an action with little or no chance of success, into one with a standard chance of success.  Ex.  Even for a superhero, diving through the window of a moving car, snatching the kidnapped child out of the seat and out the other side window without causing a crash or hurting the child would be nigh impossible. A blue chit makes this a simple matter of Acrobatics and grab roll situation.

• Insert Minor Dramatic Moment: The player may state a dramatic moment into a scene that can initiate story, resolve story. Similar to Minor Scene Change, Minor Dramatic Moment is less about adding an element to the current scene, as to initiating a scene or resolving one. Example: Vigilante Squad has just finished off Don Montelli's goons in the warehouse, as the sounds of sirens and stamping of SWAT boots approaches. A player pushes forward a blue chit and says, "As the police rush in, the smoke clears to find the bodies of Montelli's men, but no sign of us. The police surround the area and helicopters sweep, but we are gone, vanished in the night. My intent is that we get away and don't have to hassle with the law... at least this time."  This would be appropriate, assuming the table agreed it was within the bounds of the fiction, and didn't make things unfun, etc.

• Bypassing a successful Block.  Player may choose to throw a blue chit so that an attack that is successfully Blocked still carries through, effectively negating the block.  Only a blue chit thrown in response can reassert the Block’s success. 

• Move a result on the Hit Location chart up or down 3 places, either defensively or offensively. (Only used in Heroic games where Hit Location is used.)

• Gold Chit: There is only one Gold Chit and it has unique abilities.  Using the gold chit allows ONE of the following by choice of the player. 

• Any one of the benefits of the white, black or blue chits as listed above, without GM drawing a chit. (But this would be a waste.)

• Primary use of the gold chit is to allow the player to become storyteller/GM in powerful ways.  By spending the gold chit, the player gets to insert a scene, event, plot point, result or other situation that they wish to occur.  This normally focuses on their character and that character’s Story, but it can encompass the group if all player’s agree. GM still has last word, but mostly it is a group decision on “Is that cool and interesting as a story, and does it make sense for what is happening currently?”  Whatever the event/situation/scene, it should have significant effect on current and even future plots, though specific results or repercussions may be unforeseen. Player intent is key. What is the "outcome" the player wishes to occur?

             Red Chit: There is only one Red Chit and it has unique abilities.  Using the red chit allows ONE of the following by choice of the player. 

                        Exactly the same benefits as the Gold Chit, BUT the GM then takes possession of the Red Chit and has it to be activate a very clear obstacle/challenge/things-go-badly scene against the PCs. You spend the Red Chit knowing that karma is a  bitch.

 

GM: Draws after all players.  One chit per PC, plus chits for any NPCs/Villains who may have Luck. 

Unluck:  Unluck reduces the number of Luck chits drawn for every level.  This primarily effects the GM and the use of Luck chits for certain NPCs, as it is unlikely a PC would take Unluck.  

[Killer Shrike]

On 8/24/2018 at 8:02 PM, Jazzidemus said:

It reads well how is it in execution?

 

I allowed it as an option for many years in a variety of genres and it works very well in execution, at least in my opinion and that of the players in various games who used it. It makes its usefulness quantifiable and puts it entirely into the control of the player. It is direct probability manipulation as opposed to hand-wavium.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think that the vague version of Luck in the HERO System offers something as well, as a sort of deus ex machina power. The Intervention ability in Here There Be Monsters is a direct re-casting of the by-the-book Luck power for instance. It's essentially a "miracle" power; roll the dice and hope for the best.

 

However for most "lucky" sfx characters, the direct dice result manipulation version is more practical and gets less tiresome, again in my opinion.

 

A good indication of it's efficacy is that in my experience back in the day players who knew what was up did not bother taking the standard Luck power in RAW, instead relying on skill bonuses or skill levels with the sfx of "lucky" and other such crab-wise attempts to model luck as succeeding more often than average at various tasks. The occasional newb might take Luck, but would invariably be disappointed with it in practice and regret taking it. I offered up the original version of the point based variant for a player wanting a probability manipulating super, and it worked out well and became available for later games. Players started to take it here and there...not so many as to indicate that it was too good and not so few as to indicate that it sucked...it sat nicely in the "goldilocks zone" of providing good value for the cost but not so much as to make it stupid to not take some.

 

 

[Jazzidemus]

I really like this idea. I think I'm going to try this version. I thiught about the luck bennie, but I like the Luck Pool. I may try a flipside where a character with unluck has a pool for me to use in combat and what-not using the same guidlines. 

Thank you everybody for helping me with this. And some of my other ideas. When i have questions, ideas, or a wall you all always come through, thank you.

[bluesguy]

We are currently using Luck in combination with Hero Action Points.  I have everyone roll 4d6 and add the body for HAP.  The character who has luck gets to add +1 to the final outcome.  This seems to be working pretty well.

[dsatow]

I currently use luck as a re-roll mechanism.  This has been explained in a variant rules thread a while ago.  I side with the group that the RAW is a bit to ambiguous for my tastes.

[Jazzidemus]

I think the spirit of the power is a narrative/ seat of pants vibe. However i think most players & Gm's alike want a more difinitive description/ usage of the power.  Its possible with the RAW is why we dont see more people use the power, just seems to be a waste of points and no face value pay out IMHO.

[Tech]

What is a bennie or chit?

[dsatow]

54 minutes ago, Tech said:

What is a bennie or chit?

 

A bennie is a slang/shortened term for benefit(s).

 

A chit is a board game term used normally to refer to a small card board counter of some type.  

[RDU Neil]

19 hours ago, Tech said:

What is a bennie or chit?

 

As stated... bennie can refer to any "benefit" but also refers to the "thing" you use (a poker chip, a glass chit, a counter, etc.) to show that you have a resource to spend.

 

When I refer to a "chit" I'm speaking to a small glass stone of a color that indicates a certain "benefit allowed".

[薔薇語]

How I have used or seen used in other games:

 

Roll Luck at the start of a in-game day or session (which ever is shorter). The body represents the number of rerolls available to that character. These are rolls for attack, skills, and even attacks directed at the PC. Always take the player favorable result. 

 

In addition, if there is ever a question of if something is possible wherein the GM is questioning it or a moment wherein things could go in one of two directions, the player may expend a luck point for their more favorable outcome. This is usually in addition to the reroll mechanic but could be a common pool to use for both.

 

Luck has never been a common mechanic in the games I ran or played in, though. 

 

La Rose.  

 

 

[Jazzidemus]

On ‎8‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 9:19 PM, BoloOfEarth said:

One of the PCs is a mage with a spell that gives up to 8 people 5d6 Luck for several minutes, so it mainly gets cast at the start of practically every combat for him and his teammates.  To give it a tangible effect, we decided to have them roll the Luck dice and count BODY - and that total they could spend to add to to-hit and/or skill rolls.  And any "6" rolled also gave them a re-roll for any to-hit or skill roll. 

Ok, so Bolo. Do you count the body because of it being 5d6 so they wont have a huge pool or because the spell gets used so often? I'm leaning towards pips.

[Tech]

So, Jazz, have we answered your question?