WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

[Snake Gandhi]

So, the scenario’s been done in today’s comics. A band of superheros see the corruption of the worlds governments and decide they can do a better job. They take over and proceed to run the world how they see fit. This time, however, we see it from the other side...

 

Imagine that in your campaign world, there is a super team. They’ve been around for a while, and you know them as violent and aggressive, but well meaning, and they’ve saved the world on a few occasions. Now, however, there’s been a shake up in the team, and they’ve decided that the world needs them to do more.

 

One way or another, they take control of some downtrodden third world nation. Surprisingly, they turn the place around and it becomes a surprisingly good place to live even with the ‘heroes’ as dictators. One by one a lot of poor nations flock to them, and they slowly begin fixing things in poor nations around the world.

 

Sounds good, right? However, before long the team begin targeting trouble nations and asking them to join their ‘alliance’. Some refuse, and in turn are simply invaded. They fight, but have no chance. Before long they simply quit asking and invade ‘for the peoples own good’. The rest of the world condemns these actions, but for one reason or another they can’t intervene.

 

Now however, the team has forced most of the third world into it’s ‘alliance’ and has turned it’s sights to the first world. The leader of the team appeared one day at the UN and gave a declaration. Each and every nation on the planet has exactly 7 days to submit to them and join their alliance willingly, or be taken by force. Naturally, most of the first world nations don’t take this lightly, and they quickly move from concerned to object terror.

 

See, along the way many other supers have joined their side, both heroes and villains, out of either idealism, greed, or just plain wanting to be on the winning side for a change. As such, the team has formidable power behind them, and with the super-tech at their disposal they’ve turned the barely adequate militaries at their command into a powerful fighting force. And that’s not counting the team themselves. The first world nations quickly confer and come to a startling realization.

 

They can’t win.

 

Every scenario they run, every simulation they try, they lose. They simply don’t have the firepower to match the other side. Even each governments super agencies end up out numbered and out powered by the opposition. And here in lies the scenario...

 

What would your character and his team do if they where facing this situation. Figure for any resource the governments of the world can pull out, the alliance can match and defeat. Any allies the nation might have (Atlantis, extraterrestrials, etc) the alliance have ones that are they’re equal. And then theirs the team itself. It’s the JLA, the Avengers, a world beating team who don’t have restraint. If you’re an average level Champions team figure they are equal to your wolrd's most powerful team. If you play in an equivalently powerful team, Justice League level or what have you, figure that the team is your Squadron Supreme, each member is a shadow of one of yours. For every Superman you have, they have a General Zod, for every Reed Richards they have a Dr Doom. They are every bit your teams equal, but they don’t have any restraint. They see themselves as saving the world, anyone who stands in their way is part of the problem and is to be destroyed.

 

So the question is, what do you do? They won’t listen to diplomacy, after all, they are in the right and are saving the planet (according to them). And they represent a fight you might not be able to win.

[Chuckg]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

This is a tough situation to live through -- but given how narrow the range of possible options has become, an easy one to figure.

 

If the choices are 1) surrender 2) die fighting or 3) kill them , then I say go for option 3 -- and cheat however much you have to to make it happen.

[teh bunneh]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

About 2/3 of my characters would be on the "Authority" team from the beginning, or would have joined it as soon as they started making a difference. So I'm not sure what the problem is here?

[Snake Gandhi]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

This is a tough situation to live through -- but given how narrow the range of possible options has become, an easy one to figure.

 

If the choices are 1) surrender 2) die fighting or 3) kill them , then I say go for option 3 -- and cheat however much you have to to make it happen.

What it comes down to (at least IMO) is are your characters prepared to fight a world war that they might not be able to win?

[Snake Gandhi]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

About 2/3 of my characters would be on the "Authority" team from the beginning' date=' or would have joined it as soon as they started making a difference. So I'm not sure what the problem is here? [/quote']Well, there's always that option:D

 

I have to admit, one of my teams, maybe half would likely jump ship.

[megaplayboy]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Well, considering that such a team would probably be plotting to kill our team, the logical move is to find a way to gain the upper hand. At the very least, gaining some leverage would buy time, and get the authority-types to pause in their crusade while they try to figure out how to surmount this new obstacle. Then you look for ways to undermine their support, to gain new support yourself, and to circumvent any advantages they may have.

[Cancer]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

What it comes down to (at least IMO) is are your characters prepared to fight a world war that they might not be able to win?

 

Of course. If you don't answer that question in the unhesitating affirmative, you shouldn't be in the hero biz.

 

That doesn't mean you have to be impatient and stupid, however.

[Zed-F]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Move to a happier plane of existence? Maybe with a Cthulhu-bomb left behind for good measure?

 

More realistically, how about pretending to go along with it and starting a resistance movement within the enemy camp, out of those groups that didn't like getting taken over?

 

Ultimately, if the GM says night falls on western civilization, then night falls on western civilization. But that's not the sort of game I'd be interested in playing in. So from a player point of view it might be time to pick up the books and go home.

[Lethosos]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Ah, a much better WWYCD than Omelas, IMO. Understandable shades of grey here.

 

Queen of Spades is of mixed minds about this. Despite the fact that she's still something of the 'lower ranks,' she doesn't like the idea that a group of immoral superheros, despite their honest intentions, are forcefully remaking the world in their image. A pig can be dressed in a tutu, shoot laser beams out of its eyes, and fly, but it's still a big, fat pig.

 

She'll have to consider her options very carefully--but as there's a moon around Earth you won't be seeing her with them.

[Chuckg]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

What it comes down to (at least IMO) is are your characters prepared to fight a world war that they might not be able to win?

 

That's exactly what we'd be doing if the Hzeel showed up with an invasion fleet, innit?

 

And I wasn't thinking so much a world war as I was thinking a few strategic assassinations. Would-be god-kings such as this, flush in triumph in the early years of their rule, generally have "ensure the royal succession" as a very low-priority item on their to-do list.

[Snake Gandhi]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

More realistically, how about pretending to go along with it and starting a resistance movement within the enemy camp, out of those groups that didn't like getting taken over?

that's certainly something i could see your sneakier Batman types doing.

 

Ultimately, if the GM says night falls on western civilization, then night falls on western civilization. But that's not the sort of game I'd be interested in playing in. So from a player point of view it might be time to pick up the books and go home.

Basically, our GM ran an 'Authority' style game before, and he wanted to see what the PC's would do from the other side. We fought, and thanks to creativity and a little luck we beat them, though we lost 3 PC's doing it.

 

It was a hell of a game, but we had a hell of a GM.

[Hermit]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Move to a happier plane of existence? Maybe with a Cthulhu-bomb left behind for good measure?

 

More realistically, how about pretending to go along with it and starting a resistance movement within the enemy camp, out of those groups that didn't like getting taken over?

 

Ultimately, if the GM says night falls on western civilization, then night falls on western civilization. But that's not the sort of game I'd be interested in playing in. So from a player point of view it might be time to pick up the books and go home.

 

Summed it up pretty well for me also. Like James T. Kirk, I don't believe in a no win scenerio (Mind you, that doesn't mean the win wouldn't come with some BIG sacrafices) Some, not all, of my characters would have put a stop to this before it snowballed. Darn sure the NPCs in most settings I am in would have even if my PCs couldn't.

 

That aside, there's no reason you can't play along then sabotoge for all its worth. For that matter, the waiting game (if it was already too late) might have them implode. If even THAT isn't possible, then I'd be tempted to start looking for another game. The GM doesn't seem to want a game, he wants a movie script.

[Hermit]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

 

Basically, our GM ran an 'Authority' style game before, and he wanted to see what the PC's would do from the other side. We fought, and thanks to creativity and a little luck we beat them, though we lost 3 PC's doing it.

 

It was a hell of a game, but we had a hell of a GM.

 

Ah, that's a horse of a different color. I misunderstood the set up I think.

[Snake Gandhi]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

And I wasn't thinking so much a world war as I was thinking a few strategic assassinations. Would-be god-kings such as this, flush in triumph in the early years of their rule, generally have "ensure the royal succession" as a very low-priority item on their to-do list.

Do-able, though assasinating a 'Superman' ain't the easiest thing in the world to accomplish. And I know some heroes wouldn't go for that no matter the cost. (I know our team didn't)

[Chuckg]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Oh, true, Starguard wouldn't go for this option at all -- but most of her teammates /would/. And if any of the 'Authority' were demonic in origin (and to be the opposite counterpart of her archangelic self, they might very well be), even she wouldn't have qualms.

 

My /other/ characters, OTOH, don't have total commitment CvKs. Some of them don't have /any/.

[Stone]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Hmmm...sounds kinda familiar...in the campaign I am currently playing in, we are facing a would be world dominating villina that we have no hope in defeating. The GM has already told us we will never be able to surprise the villian or his team.

 

Quantum - After losing his temper, he would begin trying to recruit and organize other heroes. Then would try to figure out a way to stop the other side. Once it becomes clear that the 1st world countries cannot stand up to an attack from the "villians", he would plan a pre-emptive strike in the hopes he could take out some of the other sides' heavy hitters or cause enough damage to delay the attack long enough for the 1st world countries to come up w/a defense.

 

Spector - being half dead kinda gives you a different look on things. One government is kinda like another. He is more interested in protecting the few innocent souls left in the world.

 

Stone - When/where is the fight and what should I wear?

[Snake Gandhi]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Quantum - After losing his temper, he would begin trying to recruit and organize other heroes. Then would try to figure out a way to stop the other side. Once it becomes clear that the 1st world countries cannot stand up to an attack from the "villians", he would plan a pre-emptive strike in the hopes he could take out some of the other sides' heavy hitters or cause enough damage to delay the attack long enough for the 1st world countries to come up w/a defense.

This was pretty much our answer. Rally the troops and hope to take the other side down before they can attack. This way, even if we fail hopefully we weakened them enough for the combined government forces to prevail.

[Whitewings]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

In Seeds, this could actually happen. Assuming Faye's not a part of the taking-over teams (she wouldn't be, it would be against her nature), then when and if war's declared... Thor strike the bad guy headquarters. To quote Heinlein, "I think we can stop throwing rocks at Cheyenne Mountain now."

"Why's that?"

"It's not there anymore."

[Tiree]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

I tend to play dark and greedy characters.

 

So, if this happened my character would of A) been a founding member or joined up soon after and worked their way up to being one of the heads.

 

In either case, if I saw the organization turning evil - that is where I would usurp control and form a coup. Of course using my flunkies to soften the organization up for either a) My character to take over or Other governments to take them down and pay my characters lots of money in the process.

[assault]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

One way or another' date=' they take control of some downtrodden third world nation.[/quote']

 

This is when you kill them. You don't wait until they threaten the rest of the world.

 

Codes versus killing don't apply to Nazis.

[Snake Gandhi]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

This is when you kill them. You don't wait until they threaten the rest of the world.

 

Codes versus killing don't apply to Nazis.

But what if they did it non-violently? And at the begining, they are making things better, such as removing tinpot dictators and making sure people get food and shelter.

 

It takes them about 6-7 weeks to get from that to "give us the world or we take it from you."

[Hermit]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

But what if they did it non-violently? And at the begining, they are making things better, such as removing tinpot dictators and making sure people get food and shelter.

 

It takes them about 6-7 weeks to get from that to "give us the world or we take it from you."

 

Well, in Recluse's case, Grandmother Spider would probably tell him bad things were coming, and Jynx a proto goddess, might fill the Saints in. So yeah, fife like, some heroes might know to nip nip nip it in the bud. Though, speaking for my own, killing them is a bit... no, LOT extreme.

[Blue]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Uncle Slam has the hardcore CvK. He's killed in the past but changed as a person. There's no way he would willingly kill someone, and even if it came down to a split second decision to save millions by killing one of these "heroes", he'd be unlikely to carry through. He would definitely fight them. He's perhaps the second most powerful hero in my campaign, the other being retired, but then my campaign is FAR below authority level. They'd have a hell of a time killing him though.

 

Anthem would definitely run some kind of street level resistance. She might even be doing it all by herself, but she'd definitely try to turn public opinion against them. The ends do not justify the means, and freedom is for everyone.

 

Audra Blue would be all in favor of them. The world is a screwed up place and it's important to set things right whenever possible.

[Metaphysician]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

Microman II: Would naturally be ready to oppose them. However, his initial thought is something like this. . .

 

"Horus-Re, is there any way we could briefly shunt them into your father's realm??"

 

Diomedes: League. Out of. Hopelessly.

[assault]

Re: WWYCD: Anti- 'Authority'

 

But what if they did it non-violently? And at the begining' date=' they are making things better, such as removing tinpot dictators[/quote']

 

The "removing tinpot dictators" is when the killing starts.