From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

[Kap]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

Speaking of Super Friends, anybody ever write up Zan & Jayna, Gleek, Apache Chief, Samurai, and the like?

 

Anybody ever write up the Hall of Justice as a base?

 

I kinda want to play Super Friends now...with slightly better plots and the characters allowed to actually hit people.

 

Also, just for fun: if Super Friends had been Marvel rather than D.C., which characters do you think they would use and why? Limit yourself to the same number of characters as the cartoon did! And no simple substitution of so-called analogues, i.e., Sub-Mariner for Aquaman just because both are aquatic.

 

--Kap

[Captain Obvious]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

Also, just for fun: if Super Friends had been Marvel rather than D.C., which characters do you think they would use and why? Limit yourself to the same number of characters as the cartoon did! And no simple substitution of so-called analogues, i.e., Sub-Mariner for Aquaman just because both are aquatic.

 

--Kap

 

Heh...a couple years back, there were a couple of graphic novels which were basically DC characters if Stan Lee had created them. I just flipped through it, but some of his takes on the DC heroes seemed pretty interesting.

[megaplayboy]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

Speaking of Super Friends, anybody ever write up Zan & Jayna, Gleek, Apache Chief, Samurai, and the like?

 

Anybody ever write up the Hall of Justice as a base?

 

I kinda want to play Super Friends now...with slightly better plots and the characters allowed to actually hit people.

 

Also, just for fun: if Super Friends had been Marvel rather than D.C., which characters do you think they would use and why? Limit yourself to the same number of characters as the cartoon did! And no simple substitution of so-called analogues, i.e., Sub-Mariner for Aquaman just because both are aquatic.

 

--Kap

 

I don't know if it's exactly analogous to the Super Friends, but Marvel's Super Hero Squad show is pretty kid-oriented, and the basic character lineup includes Captain America, Falcon, Hulk, Silver Surfer, Thor, Ms. Marvel, Wolverine and Reptil, a young apprentice superhero who can copy the powers of dinosaurs. Scarlet Witch joins in season 2. Dr. Strange makes a cameo appearance in a few episodes.

[Zen Archer]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

Also, just for fun: if Super Friends had been Marvel rather than D.C., which characters do you think they would use and why? Limit yourself to the same number of characters as the cartoon did! And no simple substitution of so-called analogues, i.e., Sub-Mariner for Aquaman just because both are aquatic.

 

Captain America, The Hulk, and Spider-Man - probably the three most marketed characters from the time-period, if memory serves.

 

Iron Man - a good all-rounder.

 

Marvel Girl - telekinesis is a nice power to use for conflicts where you can't hit anybody.

[Laundry Knight]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

You might want to throw in Rick Jones to get the youth and the Impossible Man for comic relief.

[Querysphinx]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

Anyway...I think we were waiting on someone to tell us the difference between "complex" and "realistic" with regard to super hero games/stories.

 

I may be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time, but the tenor of you posts suggests you don't want an answer, you want an argument.

 

Nevertheless:

Realistic (adj): Conforming to reality and the empirical observation of objective facts.

Complex (adj): Consisting of many interrelated parts.

 

While it is true that there is a great deal of overlap between realistic and complex because reality is complex, not everything that is complex is realistic.

 

When one plays a superhero game or reads a superhero story or watches a superhero movie, then one throws realistic out the window. Super powers do not exist. Period. If take them as given, however, we may then ask two different types of questions: "What does this do?" and "What does this mean?" These are not mutually exclusive, but they are used in different ways at different times. "What does this do?" questions generally revolve around using powers as tools in new and innovative ways to solve different sorts of tactical or strategic problems. "What does this mean?" questions generally revolve around moral choices and identity quandaries. (i.e. I can do this, but should I?).

 

I like stories that involve both sorts of questions. Where characters are not defined solely by what they are fighting against, where there are more than two points of view and not necessarily only one correct answer. I want the players and their characters to have to work hard sometimes to figure out what is right, but unrealistically, I want to put triumph within reach.

[Ninja-Bear]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

Speaking of Super Friends, anybody ever write up Zan & Jayna, Gleek, Apache Chief, Samurai, and the like?

 

Anybody ever write up the Hall of Justice as a base?

 

I kinda want to play Super Friends now...with slightly better plots and the characters allowed to actually hit people.

 

Also, just for fun: if Super Friends had been Marvel rather than D.C., which characters do you think they would use and why? Limit yourself to the same number of characters as the cartoon did! And no simple substitution of so-called analogues, i.e., Sub-Mariner for Aquaman just because both are aquatic.

 

--Kap

 

Diericck Heimforth had a document on running a Super Friends game--no write ups though. I've rewatched some of the Super Friends and the Marvel Super Hero Squad. I hate the animation of the SHS it made it too kid like. And i don't know how to express it, but there is a different feel to them. SHS seems to be childess for childess sake whereas SF does strip away stuff for children to understand but still dealing with adult themes. I can't express it, but is a difference. Best I can say is that SF stories are mostly aesops with that simple type of approach for kids.

 

As for realism in my games, even in the more "realistic" type games, such as Dark Champions, I don't want to be too realistic. If I want realism, I go outside. But if that's what you like, it's all good. Heck I would even play in a game to check it out, just give me a heads up first. : )

[dmjalund]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

As I've said before: Yeah' date=' that would be as silly as liking "self-made men" and lottery winners but hating people with inherited wealth. Oh wait. People actually do that. Besides the mutants aren't doing themselves any favours by calling themselves "homo superior", and forming "racially" exclusive militias that fight in semisecret over control of the world.[/quote']So it's the Malcolm X-Men

[kahuna's bro]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

r

I appreciate that and would give you "rep" if I knew how, but it doesn't make the coroner's report unrealistic. You stated that all narratives are unrealistic. Realism doesn't mean you have to include the color of the drawers in which the corpses reside, and how many hairs are on the jacket's sleeve. Missing or excluded information doesn't equal unrealism. Facts can be left out and a narrative can still be realistic. As in the case of the coroner's report.

 

In fact, the coroner's report can be downright wrong but still realistic.

 

Anyway...I think we were waiting on someone to tell us the difference between "complex" and "realistic" with regard to super hero games/stories.

click on the star in the lower left cornr when the box come up write a comment

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

And by "stat" he means "star."

 

Not to be pedantic about the type-o, just to prevent someone looking for a mouseover about stats. =)

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

I'll toss my vote in for JLU/DCAU tone being favored.

 

Or late Silver, early-Bronze age, but without the GM being a d-bag and saying, "You roll to catch Gwen in your webbing... but the shock at the bottom breaks her neck!"

 

Seriously. I'll never let Gerry Conway GM for me.

 

As for Watchmen, I find it odd that the OP used it at the counter example, then later describes the style of game as:

 

Or are you in the game to punish the guilty, devoted to justice to the point of your characters having no personal life, wading through a river of blood and gore?

 

The Watchmen definitely had personal lives. I don't know that the thing is nearly as revolutionary or as important to comics history as a lot of people seem to think, though. The story was just a morality play hung over a fairly simple plot. The characters having some depth is what made it work for me, though.

[kahuna's bro]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

And by "stat" he means "star."

 

Not to be pedantic about the type-o, just to prevent someone looking for a mouseover about stats. =)

thanks

[Kap]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

Diericck Heimforth had a document on running a Super Friends game--no write ups though. I've rewatched some of the Super Friends and the Marvel Super Hero Squad. I hate the animation of the SHS it made it too kid like. And i don't know how to express it, but there is a different feel to them. SHS seems to be childess for childess sake whereas SF does strip away stuff for children to understand but still dealing with adult themes. I can't express it, but is a difference. Best I can say is that SF stories are mostly aesops with that simple type of approach for kids.

 

As for realism in my games, even in the more "realistic" type games, such as Dark Champions, I don't want to be too realistic. If I want realism, I go outside. But if that's what you like, it's all good. Heck I would even play in a game to check it out, just give me a heads up first. : )

 

I saw a couple of episodes of the Marvel Super Hero Squad show. I didn't like them. The voices were too squeaky and I couldn't stand the weird body proportions and jokey antics. I'm not their target audience, but I wouldn't let my son watch it either when I have DVDs of Super Friends he can see. It seems like they've aimed not just at kids, but stupid kids.

[Clonus]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

I'll toss my vote in for JLU/DCAU tone being favored.

 

Or late Silver, early-Bronze age, but without the GM being a d-bag and saying, "You roll to catch Gwen in your webbing... but the shock at the bottom breaks her neck!"

 

Seriously. I'll never let Gerry Conway GM for me..

 

What? He rolled badly.

[Zen Archer]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

You might want to throw in Rick Jones to get the youth and the Impossible Man for comic relief.

 

Good point. I was just thinking of the main five.

 

I'd hate to see Rick get the "Marvin" treatment, though.

[Zen Archer]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

I saw a couple of episodes of the Marvel Super Hero Squad show. I didn't like them.

 

I wasn't fond of them, either. I really wish they had adapted Chris Giarrusso's Mini Marvels instead.

[sinanju]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

I'm playing in a game currently that is definitely populated by PCs who are closer to the Watchmen end of the spectrum. We're mutants working for DHS, investigating, and capturing mutants causing problems. "Capturing with extreme prejudice, right?" is a common question from one PC whenever we're given a new task.

 

Part of it is that we were given a very limited budget of points (60 points for a single power, no limitations*, but take all the advantages you like). No stop-sign powers. Plus 45 points for stats (NCM applies), and a pool of about 42 points for skills, including a set of mandatory skills we learned in training. We also have a badge, a smart phone, a flashlight, and a handgun (Sig Sauer P229R, 2d6+1 RKA) and two clips. Now...go get 'em!

 

Of the five players, one (me) is a shapeshifter who has no combat-oriented power. One can produce a Flash effect (3-hex AOE Flash vs Sight, Hearing, Smell, Taste, Touch, and Mental senses). It's good for slowing up the enemy, but that's about all.** One PC has a forcefield which renders him fairly safe from most attacks, but he has...a handgun. The fourth PC can open doorways through most any conceivable barrier (Tunneling vs 24 PD), but...no combat powers. Only the last PC, ex-military with a mutant-powered HKA (his lethal karate chop) is very effective against most of our opponents.

 

As a result, we tend to get stomped if we're not very careful, and we responded by getting extremely trigger-happy. Our last mission, retaking control of a prison under the control of the mutant prisoners, ended with us summarily executing them because the cells had all been destroyed and we couldn't contain them when/if they regained consciousness. We've covered up that bit of, uh, extracurricular activity so far...but we're expecting to be found out eventually.

 

*We could TAKE limitations, mind you, but we didn't get a cost break for them.

 

**Sure, the bulletproof monster can't see or hear. He's still bulletproof. And more than capable of killing us if he gets his hands on us.

[Pattern Ghost]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

My first thought was, bad GM. Then I realized your group made a bunch of non-combatants in a mutant hunting campaign and I forgave your GM. =P

[kahuna's bro]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

I'm playing in a game currently that is definitely populated by PCs who are closer to the Watchmen end of the spectrum. We're mutants working for DHS, investigating, and capturing mutants causing problems. "Capturing with extreme prejudice, right?" is a common question from one PC whenever we're given a new task.

 

Part of it is that we were given a very limited budget of points (60 points for a single power, no limitations*, but take all the advantages you like). No stop-sign powers. Plus 45 points for stats (NCM applies), and a pool of about 42 points for skills, including a set of mandatory skills we learned in training. We also have a badge, a smart phone, a flashlight, and a handgun (Sig Sauer P229R, 2d6+1 RKA) and two clips. Now...go get 'em!

 

Of the five players, one (me) is a shapeshifter who has no combat-oriented power. One can produce a Flash effect (3-hex AOE Flash vs Sight, Hearing, Smell, Taste, Touch, and Mental senses). It's good for slowing up the enemy, but that's about all.** One PC has a forcefield which renders him fairly safe from most attacks, but he has...a handgun. The fourth PC can open doorways through most any conceivable barrier (Tunneling vs 24 PD), but...no combat powers. Only the last PC, ex-military with a mutant-powered HKA (his lethal karate chop) is very effective against most of our opponents.

 

As a result, we tend to get stomped if we're not very careful, and we responded by getting extremely trigger-happy. Our last mission, retaking control of a prison under the control of the mutant prisoners, ended with us summarily executing them because the cells had all been destroyed and we couldn't contain them when/if they regained consciousness. We've covered up that bit of, uh, extracurricular activity so far...but we're expecting to be found out eventually.

 

*We could TAKE limitations, mind you, but we didn't get a cost break for them.

 

**Sure, the bulletproof monster can't see or hear. He's still bulletproof. And more than capable of killing us if he gets his hands on us.

sounds like syfys alphas

[Ndreare]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

As I've said before: Yeah' date=' that would be as silly as liking "self-made men" and lottery winners but hating people with inherited wealth. Oh wait. People actually do that. Besides the mutants aren't doing themselves any favours by calling themselves "homo superior", and forming "racially" exclusive militias that fight in semisecret over control of the world.[/quote']

 

Perfectly said

[Kap]

Re: From Superfriends to Watchmen: The Extremes of Superheroes

 

What? He rolled badly.

also no evidence Gwen was still alive at that point anyway.