bigbywolfe

I could see less flashy wizards having "work clothes" consisting of cargo shorts/pants with extra pockets and those multi-pocketed vests I've only ever seen fly fisherman on TV wear.

No, they were exclusive to backers for a year (which Steve actually says right in the 2nd post of this very thread...)

Not exactly a motivational poster, but I didn't want to start a separate thread for one meme.

I was just making a joke about how ridiculous the Drow are in general

"Ihl Beasts are found only in the underdeeps far beneath the surface of the ground...." " Ihl Beasts are powerful psychic creatures, with a mental attack so powerful they can cause permanent insanity. This insanity manifests its self as paranoia and suspicion to the point of violence and attacking friends." So... they were designed to explain Drow society?

True. I just meant that most of the issues with "horror Hero" apply to any other horror game if the group isn't invested in that type of game.

That's true with any horror game regardless of the system. If the players aren't fully on board with CoC it's just that dumb game where you go crazy and the GM kills you all the time.

I'm not going to repeat what was already discussed up thread. EDIT: From the first page: http://www.herogames.com/forums/topic/89888-shapeshifter-mode-lock/?p=2384460

Both Transform and Mind Control were already mentioned. I'm not sure what's left to explain.

Lucius, I can't tell if you are serious or just going for a joke.

Some thoughts about how SFX affects this discussion. In a lot of fiction someone using Magic to transform themselves who then gets their powers removed will be stuck in whatever form they were in. A lot of fairy tales have the trope that the witch/wizard/elf/whatever can be trapped in a certain form by removing the object that gives them the ability to shape shift. This also happens in comics occasionally. However that is far from universal. Lets look at some other SFX. Mystique and Morph are mutants whose ability to shape shift is at least partially Persistent (they can sleep without the Power turning off and them reverting) and yet when suppression collars that disable Mutant abilities are put on them (which would generally be built as Suppress) and they revert back to their original appearance. Clayface's abilities (at least one version of him) were from a chemically induced "radiation accident". When he gets hit be a solvent (perhaps a Drain?) or gets knocked out he reverts back to the lumbering clay mountain we all know and love. Skrull's shape shifting is often shown to be Persistent (in some media they revert when knocked out, in others they don't) and yet there are power suppression technologies that can take away their ability to shift, in which case they revert to their base form. I don't see how "Common and Dramatic Sense" can be used to justify using Suppress to lock a shape-shifter into a specific form across the board. I could see it in specific settings where all shifters had the same SFX and functioned the same way (and even then you are still clearly in house rule territory, which is fine), but not as a generic application for the game in general, especially when you could easily have others using Suppress's that would make them revert in the same campaign.

Actually there are 2 and both have already been mentioned in this thread and are 100% legal per RAW.

There is no Advantage that allows you to remain shifted after the power is turned off. And again, the "stay in that form" Power needs to work regardless of how the Shapeshift is built. Your solution is to use a house rule. That's fine. For reasons already stated I would not rule it that way. Also, way to go. You pointed out my typo instead of even remotely addressing the issue. You got me. Brava.

Yes, no. The power cost END by default and is Continuous. The entire time they are in the changed form they are actively using the power (even if they buy it to 0 END, or Cost END Only to Activate, they are still using it) and when they stop using it (for example, if they are knocked out) they revert back. There is absolutely no ambiguity in the rules on this. Good for you, but generally it's a good idea to explain you are suggesting a house rule, not suggesting an actual book legal solution. Also the "rarity" of shape shifters is going to vary greatly by game/campaign. Personally I wouldn't allow it because it sets a horrible president in that it fundamentally changed how Shapeshift works and completely altering how a different Power functions is not an aspect of Suppress.

It is actually expressly allowed (with GM permission) by the rules, so I'm not sure why we are discussing why it should logically be legal when it already is. Unless someone said it shouldn't be and I missed it.

That's simply not how Shape Shift works per RAW. If you want to house rule it that way that's cool, but I just don't see it being the go-to answer for most people.

But the "stay in this form" power needs to work regardless of how the shapeshift is built. Unless shapeshift is made persistent you revert back to your base form when knocked out (or the power is otherwise turned off) so Drain/Suppress is not a viable method unless you also house rule that all shapeshifters have to buy inherent for some reason. EDIT: Actually you can Drain/Suppress a Persistent power and it will turn off so they would still revert. So outside of completely houseruling how shapeshift functions it isn't actually a viable option at all.

"What doesn't kill me gives me XP."

We used to call that Champagne Taste on a Beer Budget.

When you said "very small openings" I was assuming key holes and cracks under a door type small openings, which would be Desolidification, can't pass through solid objects, doesn't prevent damage. But maybe that's too extreme for what you were envisioning.

My point was mechanically the creature does not have any powers or abilities that would allow them to fit through smaller than normal openings. No Shrinking or being built at reduced size, no Stretching or Limited Desolidification, not even a Contortionist/Double Jointed Perk (I forget the proper name off hand). You specifically describe the Haunt being able to do something it is not built to be able to do.

If they are "roughly human in volume" then how do they "fit through very small openings"?

I usually see this one captioned with a joke about "sub woofers".

She was not immune to it in Superman:TAS, it just didn't affect her as strongly or as quickly.

Environmental Movement is not a Power, it's a Talent and it still is in the rules. Champions Complete pg 40 6E1 pg 113 I don't have a PDF of 5E (I'm at work and don't have my books) but I know it was in that edition as well.