Unity vs Your Super Team

[Metaphysician]

Through various acts of the plot gods, you and your super team are now in direct conflict with the entirety of Unity ( Quasar, Dr Black, Dr White, Mentiac, Myrmidon, El Picaro ).

 

Which team walks away from this fight??

[Powerhouse]

Who is the UNITY and in which product are they detailed?

 

Thanks.

[Southern Cross]

UNITY is the UNTIL superteam and is detailed in the UNTIL: Defenders of Freedom book.

[Blue]

UNTIL: Defenders of Freedom

 

Quasar (630pt Energy Projector)

Mentiac (570pt Mentalist--only real attack is a blaster though)

El Picaro (471pt T-porting Swashbuckler)

Dr. Black & Dr. White (418pt each Magic Pool users)

Myrmidon (430pt spear-weilding brick)

 

Ya know, they've got a lot more experience than my team, but my team has numbers (14 characters). If I assume that each player only plays one of their characters, in an 9 on 5 fight, I go with my guys. They're very diverse; they'll find something to hurt them.

[Metaphysician]

I wouldn't exactly categorize Mentiac as a mentalist. He's more strictly a supergenius, who just happens to use a few mental powers as the base for some of his smarts power constructs.

[Blue]

Originally posted by Metaphysician

I wouldn't exactly categorize Mentiac as a mentalist. He's more strictly a supergenius, who just happens to use a few mental powers as the base for some of his smarts power constructs.

He's a mentalist in that he's got telepathy & mind scan. He has no damaging or combat-worthy mental attacks. As I mentioned, just his blaster seems to be useful in combat.

 

He's a problem solver and a genius, but without any other attacks or power pools, it seems his usefulness is in preparing for the meeting. So if UNITY came looking for our heroes, all decked out and prepared for this specific fight, they're going to be a bigger problem.

 

But my players have a way of overcoming most of the stuff I think will mow them down. And in this case, I don't even feel that strongly about Unity's chances.

[Chuckg]

Yes, UNTIL seems to have designed Unity for dealing with either powerful solo villains and/or low-end villain teams. I suppose high-end villain teams get both Unity /and/ a platoon of agents teched up with the bset 'brickbuster' gear that UNTIL can afford.

 

And Doctor Destroyer, natch, gets the _Ragnarok_.

 

Add -- plus, I always saw Mentiac as the team's Oracle equivalent -- not on the front lines, he's back in the control center coordinating everything and hauling out data and doing signal intelligence.

[loraxxx]

my group is 4th edition, and one thing i've noticed is that 5th edition cu characters are heavier on attack, lighter on defences and combat value compared to us, so without having the character sheets in front of me, i'd have to bet on my team, S.U.P.A over UNITY since:

 

1) we have the numbers, 7of us VS 5 of them;

 

2) we're probably going to be able to avoid their attacks, since even our brick can generate a DCV of 12 without dodging;

 

3) i believe we're higher defense characters, overall, averaging out around 25pts of resistant defense.....

[Trebuchet]

At one time UNITY's high character points would have been rather intimidating, but now that MidGuard has fought (and beat) Eurostar they don't seem quite as intimidating, and most of our team is approaching 400 CP now anyway with XP. Sounds like UNITY is more willing to use deadly force than MidGuard. Since I haven't seen the writeups for UNITY I can't really predict how it would go, but judging by what people are saying here I think we could give them a good stiff brawl with no obvious winner, particularly in light of our superior numbers. If UNITY as written is not a standup match for Eurostar, then we'd probably take them.

 

Our current lineup:

 

Zl'f - Very fast MA (SPD 9, DEX 43), acting team leader

Silhouette - Density Increasing/Desolidifying flying brick

Prodigy - Mentalist w/90 point VPP

Sidestep - Teleporting demi-brick with several TP-based ranged attacks

Eagle Eye - Traditional MA/Weaponmaster with mystical wuxia powers (wire-fu)

Thunderbird - Powerful flying EB

Vesuvius - Magma-based demi-brick/EB

Le Magister - MP-based Sorcerer

 

Another PC, Catseye, an invisible martial artist with a SPD 7, I didn't include because his player only makes about one game a year (He has to work most weekends and we only play once a month.) In a hypothetical matchup he might be included as well. And I also didn't include CyberKnight, our tough powered armor guy and official team leader, since his player is currently running Prodigy.

 

Has UNITY been released as Hero Designer files yet for DL from the Hero store? Maybe I'll go buy and download them.

[Monolith]

Unity is a nice team but they are not that powerful. IIRC only two characters have more than a 12 DC attack. Myrmidon would be the character to fear in the group. I'd like to run them at a con against Eurostar but I think UNITY would get their butts handed to them.

[Trebuchet]

Originally posted by Monolith

Unity is a nice team but they are not that powerful. IIRC only two characters have more than a 12 DC attack. Myrmidon would be the character to fear in the group. I'd like to run them at a con against Eurostar but I think UNITY would get their butts handed to them.

Every member of MidGuard except Zl'f has 13 DC or higher attacks. Her biggest attack is 10½ DC (a 7d6 AP or PEN attack). So it sounds even more likely MidGuard would prevail over UNITY.

 

If you think about it, there is good reason for UNITY not to be all powerful as hero teams go: If they're more powerful than any other team, what need is there for PCs? Especially since UNITY would likely have UNTIL agents and technology backing them up.

 

Champions is about the PCs, not NPCs. Were I to introduce them or an analogue into my campaign, it would only be so our PC team could succeed where UNITY has already failed.

[Chuckg]

Well, there is a valid game reason to have a more powerful team of NPCs -- if you're running at the 350-point level or thereabouts.

 

The answer is "To explain why the heck the Big Six Megavillains haven't bulldozered the world flat yet, since Lord knows /your/ team can't stop them."

 

Very very very /very/ few 'normal' starting Champions parties have the slightest hope of surviving Destroyer, Takofanes, etc. There's got to be at least one NPC team out there who can, or else suspension of disbelief suffers a bit.

 

Of course, the simplest way to keep this hypothetical more powerful team from poaching the PC's fun is to make sure that no matter what's happening in the game, they've got an urgent call somewhere else at the time. With a worldwide area of responsibility, this is not hard to arrange.

[Monolith]

Originally posted by Trebuchet

If you think about it, there is good reason for UNITY not to be all powerful as hero teams go: If they're more powerful than any other team, what need is there for PCs? Especially since UNITY would likely have UNTIL agents and technology backing them up.

 

Champions is about the PCs, not NPCs. Were I to introduce them or an analogue into my campaign, it would only be so our PC team could succeed where UNITY has already failed.

I think there is good reason to have teams at every power-level. I have no problem with making the PCs the star of their comic, but that does not mean there are not more powerful NPCs around. Comic book teams are about variety. Imagine the Defenders of old: Dr. Strange, Silver Surfer, Hulk, & Namor. Could you imagine a team more powerful in the Marvel Universe? Did the Avengers feel overshadowed? The FF? The X-Men? No, not at all. The PCs should not feel overshadowed by UNITY or the Sentinels or the Justice Squardron either.

 

I have no problem with UNITY not being all-powerful. I was just trying to make the point that UNITY, by itself, would probably not be able to defeat Eurostar. It would need that UNTIL back-up, and it might need some help from a PC or two.

 

I think there's room in the CU for a variety of power levels. I think it's the GM's job to make the players feel like heroes, whether they are playing 200 point Ravenswood cadets or 1,000 point Galactic Knights.

[Metaphysician]

Personally, I'd up all the members of Unity by about 100 points or so. That would let them take on pretty much any of the villain teams on even or better terms, as well as stand better chances against the lower tier Master Villains ( Gravitar, Warlord ). OTOH, I think people are underestimating their actual capability. Dr White and Dr Black may not be able to exceed 12 DC damage, but they can pull out basically any 60 point construct you can imagine. I'd much rather have that ability than the ability to toss out 15d6 energy blasts.

 

That said, I don't mind there being powerful teams in the setting, and even think Champions U needs more powerful heroes ( or at least acknowledgement of such that probably already exist ). Lets face it: 350 point heroes are roughly the equivalent of the New Warriors or New Teen Titans. They are *not* powerful, and no one sane should expect that 350 point heroes be the main thing standing between, say, Doctor Destroyer and world conquest.

[TheQuestionMan]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

UNITY vs The Champions of Vancouver?

 

It would turn into a last wo/man standing, but UNITY wins!

 

QM

[death tribble]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

The Protectors had about 75 people including the dead who came back to life and including two VPP users. So Unity who be defeated. And then the Protectors would team up with them to take on whoever did this in the first place.

[proditor]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

Justice, Inc. is currently averaging 650 pts. per member. Unity would get curbstomped.

 

Now I'm actually okay with this, as Justice, Inc. is supposed to be my World's JLA.

[NestorDRod]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

Dunno about the fight, but if the other team has any females, I'll bet dollars to doughnuts El Picaro ends up walking away with at least one of their phone numbers!

[incrdbil]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

In a past campaign of about a year and a half or so ago, I had to upgun them to make them a valid threat.

 

Current Teams I'm on: The New Defenders would have a fun fight, but once a couple of the UNITY tema go doww, they lack enough offense to take them out. And once Seer took over mentally a member or two of their team....

 

The Stellar Knights, as of right now..would mop the floor with them. Far more powerful team. UNITY isnt close to their league. Of course, UNITY doesnt exist in that campaign, the UN has too many superhuman hating members, and far too many too paranoid to let them form a Team.

[Kenn]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

Without seeing Unity's write-ups, I can't make a well-informed assessment. But the team I run has a dozen active members, including several in the 600-750 point range, and the set-up doesn't say how much of my team shows up. So, I'd guess, probably the CoJ would win.

[Warlocke]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

Well there is one option that has not been talked about, and thats the SLP. When fighting a group with greater numbers they would call in the SLP dont you think? (Silverhawk, is a good example)

 

there is also the true mentalist of the team that is NOT writen up. (he has 400pts of mental powers and mental defense usable by others).

 

just some food for thought.

[hfergus]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

Fighting my team, the Misfit League, Unity would probably win if Olorin did no know they were coming. However, Olorin would get away, probably with most if not all of the team. Then the re-match would begin with Olorin using 120 point VPP to tailor attacks and defences to take then down, one at a time if need be. The end game would be ours; but it could take a while. (Olorin can be patient, he does not age.)

[Pariah]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

Against The New Champions, UNITY is probably going to win. They'll get a good fight out of it, but The New Champs are still only around 400 points each. And for all their training, they still don't fight very effectively as a team.

 

Against the heroes of Vibora Bay, it looks like a toss-up. The VB heroes are still on fewer points than UNITY, but there's an impressive array of powers and abilities available to them.

 

Against the Freaksquad, UNITY probably puts up a pretty good fight but ultimately loses. These heroes are very powerful--more powerful than their point totals alone would indicate--and are skilled combatants. And they're all pretty hard to hurt.

 

Against the heroes of our Invasion campaign, UNITY gets their individual and collective clocks cleaned. These heroes are tactically coordinated, well above average in offensive firepower, and full of surprises. They are notoriously hard to kill or knock out--just ask the Invaders. They are, as power levels go, over the top. And intentionally so.

[薔薇語]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

Well the old champions team might be able to do it, but I would still be betting on UNITY. We were just over 350 and all were High Speed and Dex. One Flying Brick with 30dex and 6spd. One MA with Regen and 30 dex 6 spd. And Me as a low level MA, PRE / COM based leader, with 29 dex 8speed and enough Teleportation powers as to get us away safely if needed. But if UNITY knew they were going to attack us, they could stop me from teleporting.

 

Infact, if Unity knew who they were going after they could probably take down any unsuspecting small team. With two 60active points mages, they could get a nice size suppress going, along with drains and dispels to start the fight and let the mentalist pick off the weak willed, while the blaster gets whoever is left. But that is my 2cents without seeing their write ups.

 

 

The Teen Champions team at Ravenswood would have no chance. 210pt characters with 30-35 active point caps. We might last two phases with the 7 of us (5PCs and two NPCs)

 

La Rose

[bubba smith]

Re: Unity vs Your Super Team

 

UNITY vs The Champions of Vancouver?

 

It would turn into a last wo/man standing, but UNITY wins!

 

QM

i thought it was the DEFENDERS OF VANCOUVER?