I killed a fellow PC last night...

[TheQuestionMan]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

My gaming group fears the day Riot (fka Nemesis) the Brick, Duplicator, & Detective falls victim to Mind Control.

 

 

QM

[sinanju]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

I don't mean to be nitpicking here' date=' but was the command actually "Kill your friends"?[/quote']

 

Yes, it was exactly that. "Kill your friends."

 

That seems like (allowing for Psych Lims) something that you would have a fairly good chance to resist. Is "Kill your friends" something that your character would generally be likely to want to do?

 

No, it's something he'd be very opposed to. But remember, my character has "Double Effect from Mind Control and Other Mental Attacks" as a disadvantage. The bad rolled well, though not sufficiently well that anyone else succumbed--but when you take my disad into effect, I was WELL into "do things he's violently opposed to" territory.

 

Not that I don't agree with the general complaint that PC's who are Mind Controlled often try to avoid doing what they are told, but in anything other than an Iron Age campaign, it seems like there should be a way to avoid one PC killing another.

 

This turned out be a very iron age game. More so than I'd expected when it started. We killed a lot of people over the course of that game, quite intentionally. So having been mind whammied into turning on my friends, there was no reason why I wouldn't use killing force of them too.

 

Memo to Ben's next character: Resistant Defenses are worth their weight in gold.

 

Yeah. He was playing a character with multi-form and many alternate identities. He may well have had one with resistant defenses. Alas, the form he was using at the time wasn't one of them....

 

You may have noticed that multiple people have said they hate when players try to side step the effects of MC. IMO not role-playing the PC as being controlled is just as bad as any other form of Munchkin behavior, maybe even worse since it is meta-gaming at the most blatant and obvious level. If, as a GM, I allowed players to play out Mind Control the way you suggest, there would never be another mentalist in my campaign, because the NPCs would do the same thing and MC would be virtually useless.

 

Yeah, I'm perfectly willing try my best to avoid being mind controlled. I can always hope for a really bad roll by the mentalist or a good saving throw for my character, and I do. But once it's established that, yes, I've been controlled and the command is appropriate to the EGO level achieved...I'm gonna do my best to fulfill the command. If nothing else, it causes everyone to bring their A game to the table--because I won't be pulling any punches, so they better not either.

[sinanju]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

The most dangerous thing to a PC is another PC. An NPC can be restrained. When a fellow PC has it in for you, there is nothing holding them back.

 

The title to this thread sounds like a Johnny Cash song:

 

"I killed a player character... just to watch him die.

When he GMs the next game, I think I'll roll up a new guy..."

 

I can never hear "killed [whoever] just to watch him die" without thinking of the Kids In The Hall sketch.

 

"I killed a man once, just to watch him die. But then I got distracted and I missed it. My friends tried to tell me about it, but it just wasn't the same...."

[Sketchpad]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

The situation could also open some neat role-playing doors for the character as well if you guys ever go back to it Maybe taking a new psych lim like "Protective of Group" or "Guilt Ridden" may be subbed for something he has now, allowing for some neat growth.

[Badger]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

I'll bet that every member of your group now knows where your character is every hour of the day. As well as what it's armed with and where the nearest esacape path takes them... just in case.

 

A smart character would be doing that, anyway.

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Suggest keeping away form the '2x effect vs Mind Control' Disad for your next Character.

 

And maybe the one after that as well, if Ben is GMing or in the Group.

 

Comes to that, watch out if Ben ever builds a Character or NPC with this particular problem.

[sinanju]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Suggest keeping away form the '2x effect vs Mind Control' Disad for your next Character.

 

Yeah, but see--I thought that disadvantage specifically because my character was so tough physically. He needed an achilles' heel, and that was it.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

I had a character named Nightwind once upon a time that wasn't Vulnerable to Mind Control, but rather Susceptible.

Essentially if his real personality was removed from the driver's seat, then the demon sharing his body would start to take over. Cumulative Transform. Heals back like body.

 

The good news? The mind control probably isn't in effect anymore.

 

The Bad news? The demon probably enjoys the idea and will do it anyway, before pursuing whatever agenda it has.

 

That was a pretty dark game, roughly similar to Hellblazer and Grendel.

[lemming]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Yeah' date=' but see--I thought that disadvantage specifically because my character was so tough physically. He needed an achilles' heel, and that was it.[/quote']

 

More of a team disad than a character disad.

[Manic Typist]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

More of a team disad than a character disad.

 

 

If you have a good group, that's how Disads tend to be.

[Silbeg]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

If my PC is under someone else's mental influence, I don't dither, or try to be deliberately ineffective. I fight just as hard and just as enthusiastically as I do when I'm in my right mind.

 

Kudos to you for that. While I don't usually try and throw a lot of Mind Controls at the heroes in my games, it does happen. And I really hate it when the players decide to chump out. Like, for example, in the last session of my FPCA Champions game, when a character was Mind Controlled by the Overbrain to bring the shield of Aegis (the team's leader) to him, at least one player was heard to say, "then just walk 1" per round".

 

I have to respect what you did. I have been there more than once, in both Champions and D&D games... while I have never had to kill a PC, I've attacked 'em. And I try to do it with the same gusto that I do my enemies (though, of course, that's when the dice change from rolling low to rolling high).

 

I have to say, though, that that was the most fun I've had gaming in a long, long time. Most of my gaming for the last three years has been online. Which is fun, don't get me wrong, but it's not the same. Sitting around the table, rolling dice, and making wisecracks and riffing on one another's jokes--it was loads of fun. I laughed more (and frequently harder) than I have in a long time.

 

Good for you!

[Nightcrawler]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

LOL, not only did you slice him in half you kicked him (killing him for good) knocking out another player and barely missing a third one!

The vampire was good (although he was based off our exact point costs - except for the area effect mind control that was added in by the gm). If it was me I would have had at least two of them there with all the players - the dragon was a bit much and did not go where I wanted the side story to go - I was hopeing to finish it off myself but its ok as that world is no more).

At least I got your nasty sword out of your hands otherwise the whole party would have been dead.

so your next character is going to have "hunted by PC's all the time no roll" - lol, its ok we understand it was due to circumstances - you can take it down to watched

[Nightcrawler]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Yeah' date=' but see--I thought that disadvantage specifically because my character was so tough physically. He needed an achilles' heel, and that was it.[/quote']

 

You did a great job with the character, this is what a well rounded character is all about.

 

I just hope the next game is not going to be crazy with no active cap point limit.

[ParagonAlpha]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

On Mind Control:

 

A few years back I was involved in a Fantasy LARP (no jokes) and myself and two other characters were faced off against a slew of Dark Elves. Well one of the Dark Elves decided to hit me with a Mind Control effect and ordered me to kill my friends.

 

I turned and walked away, leaving the other two players standing there. Eventually the effect wore off and I returned only to get beat down by said Dark Elves.

 

I was asked, by the GM, later, why I didn't attack the two people that were with me. I said I was told to kill my friends. Neither of those two people were friends, they were simply allies. My friends were miles away.

 

The two people with me were shocked at the revelation. It got a laugh and made people nervous.

[Ian Mackinder]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Yeah' date=' but see--I thought that disadvantage specifically because my character was so tough physically. He needed an achilles' heel, and that was it.[/quote']

 

Whatever happened to Green Glowing Meteoric Rocks?

 

Actually, I am thinking in terms of retribution, kharmic or otherwise. No, I am not saying Ben would seek revenge - I don't know the guy, you do. But even the nicest gamer could not be blamed for at least having a vengeful thought or two, and there is no sense in leaving a loaded gun within reach (so to speak). Plus, simple coincidence (and the subconscious) can be pretty funny that way.

 

'2 x Effect Vs Mind Control' can REALLY screw a group over. No question of that. One nasty aspect is that it does not necessarily have to be in a PC to be an effective weapon. Obviously, that is easiest to (mis)use, but there can be much scenario potential in giving an ally, a rival, a DNPC or even a villain this particular disad.

 

 

I think you played things out pretty much as you should, given the circumstances. Then again, "just role-playing my Character" has been known to cover a multitude of sins, so maybe make sure you and Ben are OK. Just in case.

[AmadanNaBriona]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Whatever happened to Green Glowing Meteoric Rocks?

 

Actually, I am thinking in terms of retribution, kharmic or otherwise. No, I am not saying Ben would seek revenge - I don't know the guy, you do. But even the nicest gamer could not be blamed for at least having a vengeful thought or two, and there is no sense in leaving a loaded gun within reach (so to speak). Plus, simple coincidence (and the subconscious) can be pretty funny that way.

 

'2 x Effect Vs Mind Control' can REALLY screw a group over. No question of that. One nasty aspect is that it does not necessarily have to be in a PC to be an effective weapon. Obviously, that is easiest to (mis)use, but there can be much scenario potential in giving an ally, a rival, a DNPC or even a villain this particular disad.

 

 

I think you played things out pretty much as you should, given the circumstances. Then again, "just role-playing my Character" has been known to cover a multitude of sins, so maybe make sure you and Ben are OK. Just in case.

Or embrace the potential and make your new character a tragic hero and embrace your role as the GM's punching bag.

[sinanju]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Whatever happened to Green Glowing Meteoric Rocks?

 

Actually, I am thinking in terms of retribution, kharmic or otherwise. No, I am not saying Ben would seek revenge - I don't know the guy, you do. But even the nicest gamer could not be blamed for at least having a vengeful thought or two, and there is no sense in leaving a loaded gun within reach (so to speak). Plus, simple coincidence (and the subconscious) can be pretty funny that way.

 

'2 x Effect Vs Mind Control' can REALLY screw a group over. No question of that. One nasty aspect is that it does not necessarily have to be in a PC to be an effective weapon. Obviously, that is easiest to (mis)use, but there can be much scenario potential in giving an ally, a rival, a DNPC or even a villain this particular disad.

 

 

I think you played things out pretty much as you should, given the circumstances. Then again, "just role-playing my Character" has been known to cover a multitude of sins, so maybe make sure you and Ben are OK. Just in case.

 

I'm not worried. Besides, as someone pointed out elsewhere in the thread, it was the GM who decided the bad guy's command should be "Kill your friends."

 

It could just as easily have been "Defend me" (which would allow for non-lethal actions), or he could have left me trying (fruitlessly) to kill myself.

[Blue]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

It's funny but I think of all the players in my group, I'm the one who would have the most trouble with playing a mind controlled character without fudging the results. The other guys understand it and would have no problem if I had a mind controlled PC that killed them.

[BarretWallace]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Ah yes, mind control...

 

That can be a tricky beast. In an Urban Fantasy Hero game, we had one elf PC (the sniper) who was mind controlled by a vampire several times. The same vamp tried to control my dwarf, but the stumpy guy was too stubborn for him each time--though barely. Eventually our poor elf earned the ill will of the actor/swordsman who was his main target while mind-controlled. Fortunately it never evolved into outright murder but the resulting tension made for some awesome roleplaying.

 

I am currently playing in a campaign using home-brewed rules where one of my characters (each of us plays two) is possessed by a demon. Not quite the same as mind control, but there are some parallels. I'll say one thing for sure: it is the most challenging roleplaying I've done in ages, perhaps ever. Not only must I keep the other players and their characters in the dark, but I must also maintain ignorance in my other PC.

 

The demon was summoned and bound to my character (a berserker) by a powerful wizard, and its mission is to kill another PC. The catch is that the killing cannot be accomplished directly. It must be achieved through the indirect manipulation of other characters. Already I've managed to cast suspicion in the target's direction by planting some important loot in his pack (the target is a rogue). Now we have found a powerful spirit imprisoned in an urn, and my demon-possessed PC is going to enlist its help by sneaking to the chamber where the urn is stored and releasing it. It's a ton of fun, and the players are mature enough roleplayers that I need not worry about retaliation........I think...........

[Pól Ruadh]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

To me, one of the wonderful things about being in a superhero game is that almost anything is an opportunity, or, at the very least, a plot hook for the GM.

Death is no exception.

 

Maybe your character, wracked with guilt, keeps having terrible dreams about your murdered team-mate... maybe you have to make a quest to the realm of the dead... you're based on the Kurrgan, maybe in killing him, you've absorbed his essense... like Quickening... and he's now living inside your mind... or maybe inside your enchanted blade... as a bodiless spectre.

 

Maybe you wake up tomorrow and your murdered team-mate is back, with no memory of being attacked by you? Is he a duplicate? A spy? An alien shapeshifter? A hitherto unseen twin brother? Somebody messing with the timestream? HE certainly doesn't THINK he is... but could he be? A baffling mystery.

 

The vampire, his pride injured by his ignomious defeat (or maybe his sire, or a brood mate or whatever vampires have) decides that the best weapon for his revenge is the body of your team-mate, so he resurrects him using his foul necromancy or terrible vampire blood rites or what-have-you and you end up battling a very physical representation of your guilt.

Can you cure your once-friend of his unholy thirst before he kills you all? And if so, will you be responsible for killing him... again?

 

That's just off the top of my head.

[sinanju]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

"Arise! Arise oh dead thread!"

 

I didn't rename the thread, but maybe I should have. Last night MY PC got killed.

 

I've been playing Rose Hancock, flying brick. With insanely high defenses and moderate superstrength. She goes through most battles without a scratch. She got hammered unconscious once when she was entangled and then repeatedly zapped with a 20d6 energy blast. But otherwise, she's seldom been hurt.

 

That ended last night. One of the bad guys was wielding TWO railgun pistols. They were 3d6 RKA Auotfire x5, Armor Piercing, Penetrating. Each.

 

Rose has Hardened resistant defenses, but hardened against AP, not penetrating. She'd have done better taking Hardened vs Penetrating because even with AP, the guns couldn't penetrate her forcefield.

 

Alas, on his FIRST shot, the NPC rolled a critical hit. All 10 shots hit, doing 21 points of penetrating damage through her forcefield. Rose has 12 Body (she's tough because she has a forcefield, not because she's a bruiser). Took her out of the fight on the first segment....

 

Later in the battle, when Rose was up--nearly dead, but still moving--she attacked one of his team mates. So he spun around and shot her again. Doing six more points of penetrating damage as those hypervelocity slugs blew through her forcefield and killed her deader than disco.

 

Fortunately, there was a mage character there who was able to resurrect her, but--wow! That's some serious killin' power. Now Rose is conflicted, 'cause the mage who revived her is another bad guy (helping hte PCs on the "the enemy of my enemy is my tool" theory) and now Rose can't smite her with a clear conscience, darn it.

[ghost-angel]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

always always always place Penetrating first in line for Hardened...

 

 

and perhaps Rose can now lead the evil mage down the long road to redemption. Maybe.

[Balabanto]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Yeah. I don't run a high enough powered game to really allow that. Hardening stops one level of Armor Piercing and one level of penetrating when I run, because it's just too easy to build "AOE Cone Focus Destruction Man who kills everything else."

[Vulcan]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

Yeah, AF and Penetrating can be absolutely devastating. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't allow it as a GM - much less use it...

 

I will say that, as a player, if something like that happens in game - that is, the villians take the gloves 'all the way off' - my heroes will up the ante as well. Beating each other up, captures, even deathtraps are just part of the superhero genre and is to be expected. Killing someone in combat, especially with such lethal attacks, means that this is no longer a superhero story, this is a WAR story.

[CrosshairCollie]

Re: I killed a fellow PC last night...

 

That ended last night. One of the bad guys was wielding TWO railgun pistols. They were 3d6 RKA Auotfire x5' date=' Armor Piercing, Penetrating. Each.[/quote']

 

That is RIDICULOUS.