Cassandra Posted August 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Bad About DC "The New 52" "Here's an idea. Since we've written ourselves into a corner by misusing our most popular and iconic character in a bid to make things easier for us as writers, let's toss everything out and restart the whole universe again. This time we'll change their costumes and make them younger and edger, bring back some of the original characters like Barbara Gordon as Batgirl because the other half dozen or so didn't work out, and add a bunch of new characters to show how diverse and with it we are." First off, if they were staring all over again why have Barbara as Oracle at all. Second, if they wanted to start things all over again why don't they just say it's a New Universe, one that has nothing to do with anything that happened after the Crisis. Next, the writer of Wolf Creek will be writing Wonder Woman. (I'm sorry to bring that horrible movie up again but it really got under my skin.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_A Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Bad About DC "The New 52" "Here's an idea. Since we've written ourselves into a corner by misusing our most popular and iconic character in a bid to make things easier for us as writers, let's toss everything out and restart the whole universe again. This time we'll change their costumes and make them younger and edger, bring back some of the original characters like Barbara Gordon as Batgirl because the other half dozen or so didn't work out, and add a bunch of new characters to show how diverse and with it we are." First off, if they were staring all over again why have Barbara as Oracle at all. Second, if they wanted to start things all over again why don't they just say it's a New Universe, one that has nothing to do with anything that happened after the Crisis. Next, the writer of Wolf Creek will be writing Wonder Woman. (I'm sorry to bring that horrible movie up again but it really got under my skin.) I've never even heard of Wolf Creek (I'll look it up later). All I know is, there is no way in Hell the writer of 100 Bullets should be writing Wonder Woman. Worse, nobody at DC thought to themselves, "Okay, Brian wants to turn this into a horror comic.* Maybe - just maybe - he's the wrong person for the job." *Yeah there aren't enough of those in the nu52. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Bad About DC "The New 52" "Here's an idea. Since we've written ourselves into a corner by misusing our most popular and iconic character in a bid to make things easier for us as writers, let's toss everything out and restart the whole universe again. This time we'll change their costumes and make them younger and edger, bring back some of the original characters like Barbara Gordon as Batgirl because the other half dozen or so didn't work out, and add a bunch of new characters to show how diverse and with it we are." First off, if they were staring all over again why have Barbara as Oracle at all. Second, if they wanted to start things all over again why don't they just say it's a New Universe, one that has nothing to do with anything that happened after the Crisis. Next, the writer of Wolf Creek will be writing Wonder Woman. (I'm sorry to bring that horrible movie up again but it really got under my skin.) How did the Batgirl with the series that ran for 75 issues not work out? In fact before Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown, there was never a version of Batgirl that could sell their own comicbook. Barbara was never able to manage that particular feat untill she became Oracle. As Batgirl, Babs languished in comicbook limbo untill she was crippled in the Killing Joke. Let me say that again, Barbara Gordon was far more successful after she stopped being Batgirl. Also, please learn to count. Only three people have worn the Batgirl costume since Barbara went on to better things as Oracle: they are Huntress (who only wore the costume briefly), Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown. That's three people, two of whom sold exponentially more comics then Barbara Gordon did as Batgirl. Three people is not half a dozen! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greywind Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC And as Oracle, Barbara didn't carry her own book either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC One area I've always felt Marvel has a big edge over DC in is world-threatening master villains. DC has a relative handful that they keep using over and over again. They also have a habit of killing off, retiring, or just screwing up new or rebooted master villains. OTOH Marvel has dozens, of all different styles and motivations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Escafarc Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC And remember Babs was the 2nd Bat-girl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megaplayboy Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC One area I've always felt Marvel has a big edge over DC in is world-threatening master villains. DC has a relative handful that they keep using over and over again. They also have a habit of killing off' date=' retiring, or just screwing up new or rebooted master villains. OTOH Marvel has dozens, of all different styles and motivations.[/quote'] Dr. Doom. More interesting backstory and personality than Lex Luthor. Always a credible threat. Magneto. Ultron. Thanos. The list is endless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Liaden Posted August 8, 2012 Report Share Posted August 8, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Dr. Doom. More interesting backstory and personality than Lex Luthor. Always a credible threat. Magneto. Ultron. Thanos. The list is endless. Loki. Dormammu. Apocalypse. The Leader. Annihilus. The Mandarin. Kang. Mephisto. The Grandmaster. The Red Skull. Surtur. Nightmare. Count Nefaria. Baron Zemo. Galactus... you really can just keep going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assault Posted August 8, 2012 Report Share Posted August 8, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Let's see... Darkseid, Luthor, Brainiac, the Joker, Ra's Al Ghul, the Ultra-Humanite, the Brain, Gorilla Grodd, Vandal Savage, Dr Sivana, Mr Mind, Whoever Is Leading the Manhunters This Week, Egg Fu , Kanjar Ro, Batman , Hugo Strange, Black Mask, Mongul... Atomic Skull, Brother Blood, Terminator, Trigon, Eclipso, Funky Flashman, Felix Faust, Queen Bee... Meh. A silly game anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assault Posted August 8, 2012 Report Share Posted August 8, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Bad About DC "The New 52" ... Second, if they wanted to start things all over again why don't they just say it's a New Universe, one that has nothing to do with anything that happened after the Crisis. Good About DC: Earth 2. A New Universe that has nothing to do with anything that happened after the Crisis. World's Finest. Power Girl and the Huntress get their own title! Huntress is Helena Wayne! And, it's been implied that her mother was the Earth 2 Catwoman! Dial H. Boy Chimney. Pelican Army. All "New 52" titles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kahuna's bro Posted August 8, 2012 Report Share Posted August 8, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC And remember Babs was the 2nd Bat-girl. yhanks for remindin us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assault Posted August 8, 2012 Report Share Posted August 8, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC I wasn't going to mention it, but in most of the character's appearances, she was about 12 years old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Escafarc Posted August 8, 2012 Report Share Posted August 8, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC I wasn't going to mention it' date=' but in most of the character's appearances, she was about 12 years old.[/quote'] If Dick can grow up so can Betty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megaplayboy Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC I wasn't going to mention it' date=' but in most of the character's appearances, she was about 12 years old.[/quote'] Wow, um, that's a really, um, precocious 12 year old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assault Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC She did make a couple of appearances in the 70s, where she was portrayed as older. But not like that, no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megaplayboy Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Robin's voice would keep changing. A lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC The Good about Marvel: Actually signing writers like Greg Pak to in House Exclusive deals. The Bad About Marvel: Encouraging Stupid Ideas like Red Hulks, Fear Itself, Civil Wars, and running mainstream with Rob Liefeld inventions.... The Good About DC: Willing to take a Risk (at the expense of Alienating the Fanbase) on Projects like Earth 2... The Bad About DC: Alienating the Fanbase with Changes that are unnecessary and Irrelevant just to show how Hip and Edgy they are now..... ~Rex....The Good about Valiant: Everything.... The Bad About Valiant: You end up wanting more and more of their Material and it's just getting rolling again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC And remember Babs was the 2nd Bat-girl. Bah, got scooped AND, must spread Rep. Someone rep the man while I go look for where to buy that print..... ~Rex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kahuna's bro Posted August 9, 2012 Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC The Good about Marvel: Actually signing writers like Greg Pak to in House Exclusive deals. The Bad About Marvel: Encouraging Stupid Ideas like Red Hulks, Fear Itself, Civil Wars, and running mainstream with Rob Liefeld inventions.... amen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassandra Posted August 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 9, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Batgirls Bat-Girl - Bettie Kane (Flamebird) Batgirl - Barbara Gordon Batgirl - Helena Bertinelli (Huntress) Batgirl - Cassandra Cain Batgirl - Charlotte Gage-Radcliffe (Misfit) Batgirl - Harlene Quinzel (Harley Quinn) Batgirl - Michelle Carter (Goldstar) Batgirl - Stephanie Brown (Spoiler) Batgirl - Barbara Gordon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RexMundi Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Batgirls Bat-Girl - Bettie Kane (Flamebird) Batgirl - Barbara Gordon Batgirl - Helena Bertinelli (Huntress) Batgirl - Cassandra Cain Batgirl - Charlotte Gage-Radcliffe (Misfit) Batgirl - Harlene Quinzel (Harley Quinn) Batgirl - Michelle Carter (Goldstar) Batgirl - Stephanie Brown (Spoiler) Batgirl - Barbara Gordon Damn, got beat to it again. This split shift factory work is for the birds.... ~Rex... Tried to rep but spread this or that etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_A Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Damn, got beat to it again. This split shift factory work is for the birds.... ~Rex... Tried to rep but spread this or that etc... Took care of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esampson Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Loki. Dormammu. Apocalypse. The Leader. Annihilus. The Mandarin. Kang. Mephisto. The Grandmaster. The Red Skull. Surtur. Nightmare. Count Nefaria. Baron Zemo. Galactus... you really can just keep going. Not to mention Professor Xavier about every 10 years. Isn't he about due? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kahuna's bro Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC good classic comic art bad photorealistic art Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassandra Posted August 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Re: The Good and Bad about Marvel and DC Batgirl Real Name: Barbara Gordon Occupation: Systems Analyst for the Gotham City Police Department Identity: Secret Place of Birth: Gotham City Marital Status: Single Known Relatives: Jim Gordon (Father) Group Affiliation: Ally of Batman, Birds of Prey Base of Operation: Gotham City History: Barbara Gordon wore a Batman inspired costume to a party. On her way there she saved Bruce Wayne from Killer Moth. Barbara decided to continue to fight crime as Batgirl. Height: 5'6" Weight: 121 lbs Eyes: Blue Hair: Red Strength Level: Can Press 200 kg Known Superhuman Powers: None Abilities: Olympic Level Athlete. Martial Artist. Eidetic Memory. Trained in Criminology and Computer Programming. Weapons: Armored Costume. Weapons Belt with Smoke, Batarangs, Bolas, and Sleep Gas. Line Gun. Cowl with Nightvision and Radio. Batcycle. Val Char Cost 15 STR 5 20 DEX 30 18 CON 16 11 BODY 2 18 INT 8 14 EGO 8 20 PRE 10 18 COM 4 7 PD 4 7 ED 3 4 SPD 10 7 REC 0 36 END 0 28 STUN 0 Total Characteristics Cost: 100 Points Cost Skills 3 Acrobatics 13- 2 AK: Gotham City 11- 3 Breakfall 13- 3 Bugging 13- 6 Combat Luck +3 rPD +3 rED 3 Computer Programming 13- 3 Criminology 13- 5 Eidetic Memory 3 Fast Draw 13- 3 Lockpicking 13- 4 Martial Arts DC+1 4 Martial Block 4 Martial Dodge 4 Martial Strike 3 Martial Throw 5 Offensive Strike 3 Security Systems 13- 3 Shadowing 13- 10 SL: Overall +1 3 Stealth 13- 3 Streetwise 13- Total Skills Cost: 80 Points Cost Powers 10 Armor +5 rPD +5 rED, OIF: Costume (-1/2) 20 Multipower (30 Points) OIF: Weapons Belt (-1/2) 1 u) Darkness [sight] AE 2"r, Personal Immunity (+1/4), [12c/Duration 1 Turn] (+1/4), OAF: Smoke Bombs (-1) 1 u) EB 6d6, [16c] (-0), OAF: Batarangs (-1) 1 u) EB 3d6, NND [LS: Self Contained] (+1), [16c] (-0), OAF: Sleep Gas (-1) 1 u) Entangle 3d6 DEF 3, [16c] (-0), OAF: Bolas (-1) 1 u) Stretching 4", No END (+1/2), OAF: Line Gun (-1) 3 ES: Nightvision, OIF: Cowl (-1/2) 7 ES: RPT, OIF: Cowl (-1/2) 3 Flash Defense [sight] 5 Points, OIF: Cowl (-1/2) 2 Running +1" 15 Running +5", 8x NCM, Only on Appropriate Terrain (-1/2), No END (+1/2), OIF: Batcycle (-1/2) 5 Swinging 10", OAF: Swing Line (-1) Total Powers Cost: 70 Points Total Cost: 250 Points 150+ Disadvantages 5 DNPC: Jim Gordon (Useful Normal) 8- 5 Hunted: Catwoman (As Powerful/Mild) 8- 10 Hunted: Harley Quinn (As Powerful) 8- 10 Hunted: Poison Ivy (As Powerful) 8- 20 Normal Characteristics Maxima 20 PsyL: Code Versus Killing (Common/Total) 20 PsyL: Protective of Innocents (Very Common/Strong) 10 SocL: Secret Identity [barbara Gordon] (Occasionally/Major) Total Disadvantages Cost: 250 Points Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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