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Duke Bushido

Question on pathfinder

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22 hours ago, Duke Bushido said:

Thanks, PC--

 

but let me clarify something a bit:

 

I don't generally care for Fantasy. I will play it; I may even enjoy it.  It is more about the playing and the people I'm playing with. 

 

On one pointy bit, it's Fantasy.  On the other pointy bit, the D&D mechanics grate on me, from randomly generated stats to wandering monsters to character classes and alignments to the way armor doesn't work to-- well, I didn't pop up to write a dissertation.  There is no part of D&D that I like, period.  While I _do_ love Sci-Fi, I can't see myself trying to play it using the D&D mechanics.  

 

The handle is likely pointed as well, because I don't like the tropes common to D&D and their distinctive call to Tolkien), and pickle forks only have two tines.

 

I have been reading the Pathfinder 2 playtest rules. It was free, and my GM made some noise about wanting to run it. It is distant from D20 and D&D 3.5, in that the mechanics are heavily streamlined, and introduces the action economy. Stats are now a point buy, plus racial -er ancestry feats, background feats add to your stats, and then you pick your class. You can get started quickly and combat is anbit

less detailed, but it’s betterndefined. It is very different from D&D5e, but it’s not Hero. XD

 

...However it uses the same Fantasy background world as old Pathfinder, and it’s usually the same monsters and treasure, so setting wise it’s probably still a sardine flavored wedding cake for you, Duke. I’d suggest getting it to read, as it’s free, just to confirm your fears. 

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The way I look at it, if a game uses a D20 for most action resolution mechanics, including combat to-hit, features six stats called STR, DEX, CON, INT, WIS, and CHA, has classes, XP levels, hit points, armor class, saving throws, spells with vocal, somatic, and material components, and a spell called Magic Missile, then the game is either D&D or a descendant of D&D. Pathfinder fits all these criteria, and no matter how many other bits they add, it can't escape its D&D3.5/D20 DNA.

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 It's funny you should say that. 

 

Remember when silver age sentinels came out? 

 

I picked it up when it came out (loads of full-color artwork put it way, way ahead of 5e, at least in terms of appeal.) 

 

Golden and Silver age appeal to me way more than the gritty melodrama of today or the angst eighties or the antihero nineties.  Good guys have a belief in right and wrong; bad guys have motives that aren't genocide or world domination.  The characters themselves are having fun.  You can't hate that. :lol:

 

I was totally unfamiliar with what "d20 System" meant.  Took it home and thought "holy crap!  It's Dungeons and Spandex!" 

 

I gave it to a player who wanted it as a source book for the group he GMd for, and took it as a lesson learned. :lol:

 

 

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On 11/2/2018 at 8:35 PM, Duke Bushido said:

I don't generally care for Fantasy. I will play it; I may even enjoy it.  It is more about the playing and the people I'm playing with.  I still won't be having all the joy my friends are, because I can't make myself invest in Fantasy: for reasons absolutely cannot explain, I have a distaste for the genre as a whole.  It's not insurmountable, but it's there.  I know I can have a good time under the right combination of system (I have enjoyed about half the Fantasy HERO games I've been involved in), GM (anyone not trying to re-invent D&D in his pet system), and setting (anything that isn't trying to be like D&D).

 

It is funny.....  I am pretty much the same way, but for Pulp/Champions/Super Hero games.  I do not know what it is.....  I can play it...  even enjoy it if it is with the right people....  but will not seek out, nor buy super hero games.  Which is funny as I love Hero.  I love having a consolidated system.  I never understood when people said that D&D/Pathfinder was easier than Hero.  Have you seen all of the character options/feats/thinga-majigs in D&D/Pathfinder?!?!

 

In High School I played Star Wars (West End Games), Cyberpunk, and others.  It is the fact that I grew up during the "SATANIC PANIC!!!!" in corn and bean country that I never really played D&D until college.  sheesh....  Maybe that is why I never burnt out on fantasy.  After only two D&D games, I was introduced to Hero and never really looked back.  When a game ended, our group talked about the next game.  "What genre do you want to play today?  Science fiction, fantasy, cyber-punk...."  Same rules with minor tweaks/flavors.  Great for a poor college student trying to pay his way without loans.  When I moved to a different state, played 7th Sea for about 5 years.  We had a GM that loved the system.  He started running D&D, I bowed out and took a slight break from gaming. 

 

That GM moved away and I started to GM Hero.  No one else stepped up.  Ran Valdorian Age for 2 years then Turakian for 3.  One of our players wanted to GM, but was afraid of running Hero without a canned adventure for some reason.  But he still wanted fantasy...  We were told that Pathfinder fixed a lot of D&D issues and it had better adventures/campaigns.  Well..  we have been playing  Rise of the Runelords for almost 5 years(!!!) and I am burnt out.  We seem to look up and argue over the rules a lot.  We are near the end and one of our other players wants to run 7th Sea 2E.  I am curious how it will turn out.  2E seems more fluffy....  not sure I will like it, but willing to give it a shot.  Which is funny....  I consider Pulp and Swashbuckler to be similar in feel.  

 

Man....  I cannot wait to return to Hero.  Trying to come up with a Fallout/Morrow Project/Postman type of thing.  I have some time as the 7th Sea game will be about 6 months.  One of the reasons I am getting back on to the Hero forums....

 

Sorry for the long, winding, and morose post.  Just trying to say that I understand how you can be not interested in a genre at all.  I think it was you that said in another post that you are happy that discussions like this can happen on the forums without it degrading.

 

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I might have commented on the topic at hand, had Killer Shrike not given such a thoroughly excellent summation that I agree with 100%. But I feel a strange need to comment, so here's a comment:

The Pathfinder Adventure Card Game is HUGE fun. The wife and I love it. It's not the collectable type of card game. The play is AFAICT, based on their existing Adventure Paths. You'll buy a big box with the cards needed for the characters and the first scenario, then fill the box up with smaller boxes of cards for subsequent scenarios. But you get the cards you need without dealing with the TCG aspect. The rules weren't entirely ironed out in the initial set (Rise of the Runelords), so you'll need to apply errata and common sense occasionally, but the basic system is sound, and fun. It's cooperative, with the players controlling PCs. )

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Yeah, my wife, son, myself, and a friend (WilyQuixote) played thru PACG Rise of the Runelords and bought all the character packs. We also made some custom characters that we enjoyed playing (http://www.killershrike.com/CardGames/PACG/Default.aspx).

 

It was good fun and we definitely got hours of enjoyment out of it, but it could get a little tedious by the time we got towards the end. The game mostly challenges by presenting a number, with bigger numbers as you go on. Eventually you're just piling on bonuses to get a bigger number to beat the bad guy's bigger number. Which, I guess, is a sort of metacommentary on the Pathfinder rpg itself, but I'll just move along.

 

 

 

We're currently into FFG's Arkham Horror: The Card Game (https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror-the-card-game/) which in my opinion is a much better designed system for collaborative play of this sort. Similar to the Pathfinder Adventure Card Game each character has a deck of cards which will change as your character progresses, and it is collaborative, but the flow of the storylines is very smooth and, to date, never tedious (for us). We've played through the core set, several standalones, and the Dunwich Legacy and still run into new twists and unexpected outcomes. You should check it out... 

 

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Agreed that M&M is not D&D. But that should not be surprising. Not all D20 OGL games are D&D clones, despite sharing core system elements. For example: D20 Modern, D20 Future, D20 Trinity, and D20 Cthulhu, to name only a few.

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