Teleporting Objects

[Foxiekins]

I'm trying to convert an old Villains & Vigilantes character into Champions, and having a bit of a problem with the changes to Usable On Others...  The character has a 6 foot long staff, is a Master of Bojutsu, and can teleport his staff about, as long as it winds up in contact with him...  The idea is this lets him do really weird, wonky things with it in the middle of a fight...  But the myriad options for UOO give me a headache, and the version of it in my copy of Hero Designer doesn't match the book...  Does anyone have experience with the new version of the advantage...?

[Amorkca]

I would suggest making a Multipower with all of the various things you want the staff to be able to do - possibly make it Indirect as well.

 

Is it a focus? Or can he use anything to make these abilities work?  Like a 6ft plastic pipe, metal rod various objects of opportunity? 

[Chris Goodwin]

Can the staff be taken away from him, and if so how easily?  How easily can he get it back?  This defines whether it's a Focus or not.  

 

The ability to teleport it about him is entirely a special effect.  If it lets him use his other (non-Ranged) Powers through it as if he were touching them himself, then just buy it as additional reach (Stretching, 2m).  

 

If you're trying to apply Usable On Others to Teleport in order to use on the staff... that's not even necessary, given what you're describing.

 

[steriaca]

Sounds to me like a special effect for various powers.

Energy Blast, Indirect, OIF or no focus at all, with perhaps Variable Advantage (Autofire, Area Of Effect, etc).

[TranquiloUno]

1 hour ago, Foxiekins said:

I'm trying to convert an old Villains & Vigilantes character into Champions, and having a bit of a problem with the changes to Usable On Others...  The character has a 6 foot long staff, is a Master of Bojutsu, and can teleport his staff about, as long as it winds up in contact with him...  The idea is this lets him do really weird, wonky things with it in the middle of a fight...  But the myriad options for UOO give me a headache, and the version of it in my copy of Hero Designer doesn't match the book...  Does anyone have experience with the new version of the advantage...?

 

 

Well, like, what kinds of really weird, wonky, things can he do with this teleporting staff?

 

Doesn't sound like he's actually teleporting either himself or other people (right? maybe?) so then no need for Teleport and no need for UOO.

 

What stuff does he do with it in V&V?

 

 

[Greywind]

It's possible Proditor already converted said character.

[Foxiekins]

Okay, he can teleport the staff, with any change of orientation he wants, as long as it finishes touching him...

He can teleport himself, with any change of orientation/position he wants, as long as he finishes touching the staff...

 

This means you can't really take the staff away from him, so it isn't a focus...  It also makes him extremely mobile in a hand-to-hand combat...  It also isn't possible to pin or immobilize his weapon, and he can get shots in from angles that would otherwise be impossible...

[clnicholsusa]

So the staff is a special effect for attack damage (with or without range) and teleporting, plus the attack damage uses a broad version of indirect?

I find when converting VnV characters it's best to ignore the specific powers and use the VnV write-up for the FX alone, although I will confess to reverse calculating STR based on Carrying Capacity. 

 

[drunkonduty]

1 hour ago, Foxiekins said:

He can teleport himself, with any change of orientation/position he wants, as long as he finishes touching the staff...

 

This sounds like teleport with the Position Shift adder. Which is standard old teleport. The staff may represent a Floating Location (is Floating Location still a thing in 6e? I don't know.) that he can teleport to. Is there any real limitation to where he can get the staff to? Is it limited by how far he can throw it? Or does it just wind up being where ever it is that he wishes to teleport to? If the staff cannot go through walls you could buy the teleport with a "cannot go through solid objects" limitation.

 

It sounds

1 hour ago, Foxiekins said:

Okay, he can teleport the staff, with any change of orientation he wants, as long as it finishes touching him...

 

This sounds like the staff is in fact not a focus (since he can always bring it back to him) but is simply a special effect that allows him to use stretching and energy blast.

 

 

 

[Foxiekins]

A bit more...  He cut the staff from a tree he owns...  The tree came from another dimension...  He spent some time there as well, which is how he got the tree...  The only way to disrupt his power is to destroy the staff itself...  Then he has to cut another one to replace it...  So I would say Physical Manifestation, not a Focus...  He can throw the staff, and then teleport there to cover distance...  But it works much better just to alternate blinking himself and the staff, rapidly, to move over distance...

[steriaca]

31 minutes ago, Foxiekins said:

A bit more...  He cut the staff from a tree he owns...  The tree came from another dimension...  He spent some time there as well, which is how he got the tree...  The only way to disrupt his power is to destroy the staff itself...  Then he has to cut another one to replace it...  So I would say Physical Manifestation, not a Focus...  He can throw the staff, and then teleport there to cover distance...  But it works much better just to alternate blinking himself and the staff, rapidly, to move over distance...

Sounds like long-range teleportation, with the special effect of 'blinking' to throw the staff again. Since teleportation has a special rule for non-combat movement (a full move is a full phase, each increase in non-combat movement increases the time it takes to move).

 

I could be remembering it wrong.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Unless someone can physically restrain this character from being able to use the staff, its just a special effect for various powers and has no actual stat significance.

[massey]

Yeah, it sounds like he just has an interesting visual effect for Teleportation and Energy Blast.  The Energy Blast might have the Indirect advantage, or you might just use skill levels and look at the rule for "bouncing" attacks.

 

I saw a character sheet once where the super-strong guy had these invulnerable plates on his body.  If the attack hit the plates, it harmlessly deflected no matter how strong it was.  The power was written up as a simple bonus to DCV.  The "vulnerable" part of him was just a lot harder to hit.  There's almost no limit to how you can visualize a power.

[MrKinister]

I was about to say that: the staff sounds like it is a special effect for extra DCV and OCV, with amazing teleport acrobatics added in for good flavor.

[Foxiekins]

So if teleporting the staff is just a special effect, no need to spend points on it...?  That makes it easier...

[Christopher R Taylor]

You can spend a few points to be able to teleport the staff somewhere if you really want to, its going to be pretty cheap (teleport usable on another a short distance with a focus of the staff).  Teleporting it back to you would require ranged.  Teleport by its nature is already effectively indirect so you wouldn't need that.

[clnicholsusa]

You could continue to define the staff as a focus, just make it inaccessible so opponents can't grab it (because you can call it back to you with a teleport). Then the powers would go away if the staff did.

Or you could leave the staff as a special effect and create a susceptibility to having the staff removed or destroyed that, instead of damage, drains the staff-based powers away.

Or maybe the staff could be the object of an addiction that forces the powers to have an activation roll when it's removed.

 

 

[drunkonduty]

2 hours ago, Foxiekins said:

So if teleporting the staff is just a special effect, no need to spend points on it...?  That makes it easier...

 

That's how it looks to me. :-)

[Foxiekins]

21 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

You can spend a few points to be able to teleport the staff somewhere if you really want to, its going to be pretty cheap (teleport usable on another a short distance with a focus of the staff).  Teleporting it back to you would require ranged.  Teleport by its nature is already effectively indirect so you wouldn't need that.

That was my original thought, but every time I look over the Advantage in 6th edition, I get a headache...  I can usually figure something confusing out by fiddling around in Hero Designer, but when I pull UOO up in my version of HD, it doesn't match the book...

[steriaca]

3 hours ago, Foxiekins said:

That was my original thought, but every time I look over the Advantage in 6th edition, I get a headache...  I can usually figure something confusing out by fiddling around in Hero Designer, but when I pull UOO up in my version of HD, it doesn't match the book...

I would simply make it a special effect if powers and call it a day. Like Stretching, Combat Stretching Only, Only To Strike And 'Grab Staff', and a linked Hand-To-Hand Attack, and +OCV (enough for a decent Surprise Attack modifier, to simulate the attack being a bit if a surprise, without having the OCV bonus being taken away from overuse.

 

Note: Stretching, HA, and +OCV should not be an Obvious Accessible Focus. Physical Manifestation should be used, if it is to be used at all.

 

This is my car. YMMV.

[Foxiekins]

Still not clear on UOO for Teleport, but I did it as a Summon instead, given the Staff has a point total for its effects...  +4d6 HKA, 2m of Stretching, both Zero Endurance, and +1 OCV, based on the Quarterstaff in the rules....  Also using Physical Manifestation, but listing it at the -0 level...  I'll have a 400 point character build, once I work out his Complications...

[Ninja-Bear]

On 4/17/2019 at 9:32 PM, Foxiekins said:

That was my original thought, but every time I look over the Advantage in 6th edition, I get a headache...  I can usually figure something confusing out by fiddling around in Hero Designer, but when I pull UOO up in my version of HD, it doesn't match the book...

Just a thought but are you sure you are using 6th ed in HD and not 5th? It’s an easy mistake to make.

[IndianaJoe3]

On 4/18/2019 at 11:41 AM, Foxiekins said:

Still not clear on UOO for Teleport, but I did it as a Summon instead, given the Staff has a point total for its effects...  +4d6 HKA, 2m of Stretching, both Zero Endurance, and +1 OCV, based on the Quarterstaff in the rules....  Also using Physical Manifestation, but listing it at the -0 level...  I'll have a 400 point character build, once I work out his Complications...

 

It sounds like you are overthinking the mechanics of this power. Focus more on what the character is trying to accomplish, and less on the details of how he accomplishes it. For example, with the staff he can:

• Hit people - HTH Attack, with Reach
• Block attacks - +DCV
• Throw the staff and teleport to it - Teleportation
• Teleport the staff to himself

The first three are straightforward. The last doesn't need to be a Power, but it does have mechanical effects. It rules out Focus (it can't be taken away), Physical Manifestation (too durable), and Only In Alternate Identity (leaving the staff somewhere will not keep the character from using it).

 

I would write it up like this.

 

Staff of the Other Dimension:  Multipower, 54-point reserve

1. Hit Things:  (Total: 54 Active Cost, 43 Real Cost) Stretching 2m, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Usable By Other (Hand Off; +1/2), Grantor can take back power at any time (4 Active Points); Limited Body Parts (Staff; -1/4) (Real Cost: 3) plus Hand-To-Hand Attack +5d6, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Usable By Other (Hand Off; +1/2), Grantor can take back power at any time (50 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/4) (Real Cost: 40)
2. Block:  +5 DCV, Usable By Other (Hand Off; +1/2), Grantor can take back power at any time (37 Active Points)
3. Throw-and-Port:  Teleportation 30m (30 Active Points); Extra Time (Full Phase, Half a phase to throw the staff, half to port to it.; -1/2)
4. Port-to-Staff:  Teleportation 10m, Safe Blind Teleport (+1/4), MegaScale (1m = 1,000 km; +1 3/4) (30 Active Points); No Conscious Control (Only Effects cannot be controlled; The character can only port to the staff.; -1)

I hope this helps.

Edited May 1, 2019 by IndianaJoe3
Tweaked the formatting

[Foxiekins]

This is what I have done, so far...

 

Quarterstaff
Val    Char    Cost    Roll    Notes
20    STR    10    13-    Lift 400.0kg; 4d6 [2]
20    DEX    20    13-    OCV:  7/DCV:  7
20    CON    10    13-
20    BODY    10    
20    INT    10    13-    PER Roll 13-
20    EGO    10    13-    ECV:  3 - 7
20    PRE    10    13-    PRE Attack:  4d6

10    PD    8    Total:  10 PD (0 rPD)
10    ED    8    Total:  10 ED (0 rED)
7    SPD    50    Phases:  2, 4, 6, 7, 9, 11, 12
10    REC    6
40    END    4
40    STUN    10    Total Characteristic Cost:  219

Movement:    Running:    12m/20m/48m/80m
    Leaping:    5m/10m
    Swimming:    5m/10m
    Teleportation:    5m/10m

Cost    Powers    END
    Extradimensional Staff, all slots Physical Manifestation (+0); all slots Unified Power (-1/4)
8    1)  Teleportation 5m, Position Shift, Safe Aquatic Teleport, Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4) (19 Active Points); Can Only Teleport To  A Spot Where He's Touching His Staff (-1), Unified Power (-1/4)    1
18    2)  Summon 35-point creatures, Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4), Slavishly Devoted (+1), Bo From Another Dimension (+1) (23 Active Points); Unified Power (-1/4)    1
23    3)  Bo From Another Dimension:  (Total: 35 Active Cost, 23 Real Cost) Hand-To-Hand Attack +4d6, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (30 Active Points); Hand-To-Hand Attack (-1/4), Unified Power (-1/4) (Real Cost: 20) plus Stretching 2m, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (3 Active Points); Only To Cause Damage (-1/2), no Noncombat Stretching (-1/4), Unified Power (-1/4) (Real Cost: 1) plus +1 with any single attack; Unified Power (-1/4) (Real Cost: 2)
26    4)  Spatial Awareness (Unusual Group) (32 Active Points); Unified Power (-1/4)
10    5)  Stutter 'Port:  Running +8m (12m/20m total), x4 Noncombat (13 Active Points); Unified Power (-1/4)    1
34    6)  Desolidification , Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (60 Active Points); Requires A Roll (14- roll; Must be made each Phase/use; -1/4), Linked (Stutter 'Port; -1/4), Unified Power (-1/4)
    Martial Arts: Bojutsu
    Maneuver    OCV    DCV    Notes
4    Atemi Strike    -1    +1    2d6 NND
4    Bind    +1    +0    Bind, 30 STR
4    Block    +2    +2    Block, Abort
4    Disarm    -1    +1    Disarm; 30 STR to Disarm
5    Jab    +1    +3    4d6 Strike
3    Legsweep    +2    -1    5d6 Strike, Target Falls
4    Shove    +0    +0    35 STR to Shove
14    Strike    +0    +2    6d6 Strike, Autofire (3 shots; +1/4) (14 Active Points)
5    Smash    -2    +1    8d6 Strike
0    Weapon Element:  Staff

    Perks
6    Money:  Wealthy - $1,000,000 per year

    Talents
3    Bump Of Direction

    Skills
1    WF:  Staffs
2    KS: Bojutsu 11-
3    High Society 13-

Total Powers & Skill Cost:  181
Total Cost:  400

400+    Disadvantages
15    Social Complication:  Secret Identity Frequently, Major
20    Psychological Complication:  Code Versus Killing (Common; Total)
15    Hunted:  The Government Frequently (Mo Pow; NCI; Watching)
10    Distinctive Features:  Dude with a Quarterstaff (Concealable; Noticed and Recognizable; Detectable By Commonly-Used Senses)
15    Psychological Complication:  Distrustful (Common; Strong)

Total Disadvantage Points:  400

Background/History:  

Personality/Motivation:  

Quote:  

Powers/Tactics:  

Campaign Use:  

Appearance:  

 

This is him at the very beginning of his career, when he had his Origin, and is now asking "What do I do with the rest of my life?".

[steriaca]

Advancement advice:

 

Add Variable Advantage to HA. Autofire (5 shots) and Affects Desolided makes sense.

 

An Area Of Effect physical Energy Blast with Indirect makes sense also. The special effect is him tossing his staff, and then opening portals in various patterns resembling the area of effect. As the staff flys from portal to portal, it strikes various opponents (mostly via sideswiping them), then returns to your character's hands. Obviously this attack requires time (extra time, full phase), and concentration (at least 1/2 DCV), but should be worth it. You would be justified in buying it with selectable (where you must target the opponent's DCV, as opposed to the area's DCV but you get to decide who us a target in the area and who is not) and Increase END Cost (at least x2, as I don't see this as anything but an attack used only as a necessary). I would limit the area as the maximum area I can stretch to, and No Range, but those can be bought off over time.

 

Missile Deflection at range is justifiable also. The staff can not only deflection missiles aimed at you, but also others as well. Perhaps a limited area on "Block For Others" points.