SCUBA Hero

Huzzah!

5 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

I actually prefer more bland settings, so that the game is about what you and the players do, not about the bitchen unique special bizarre byzantine world that someone created.  If you have to read an encyclopedia to know what the hell you're doing, then the designers went overboard.

I like spicy settings.  Partially because (like Duke Bushido) I read them for entertainment, and also because I'm always looking for ideas to rip off use in other games, and because I like having a lot of details already spelled out.

Hey, I ran a Harn campaign for my gaming group, which was well received.  (Classic moment:  the party had picked up a cat [that was supposed to be a throw-away encounter] and kind of made it their mascot, calling it 'Shadow', so I ran with it.  The cat was injured in an encounter, and the PCs had to travel hard and fast to another place to warn the inhabitants of danger.  So I told the group, "Okay, but if you ride that hard, I'll need to make rolls for the cat - and if there's a failed roll, Shadow dies."  Player immediately drops out of character, points a finger at me and says, "Don't you DARE kill Shadow!!").

Given the opportunity, I'd like to run a Harn Hero campaign.  Don't know if it will ever happen, but if it does the story arc will include elements from canon that have enough ambiguity/mystery that I can build my own creation in the existing world.  And Harn is an *incredibly* detailed world.  And I can fall back on canon if (when!) needed.

"All of the  powers of Thor, none of the copyright issues."  🤣

Sounds very dark.  Two different evils, both justifying themselves.  If I ran a campaign like that, I'd make the player part of a third group that was trying to create Steam without expendable workers and Agriculture without slavery.  A 'new beacon' or 'shining light on a hill'...

Perhaps Lincoln would be a founding member.

On 2/11/2022 at 12:24 AM, Tasha said:

Everyone I know plays D&D of some sort or the other. They play other games, but even those tend to be D&D clones mapped to different genres. I have taught folk how to play Hero for decades. People just find it too complex esp character generation.

Yes, most of Hero System's complexity is in character generation.  I don't find the actual play that complex.

And building a first-level D&D character is fairly simple in terms of choices for the player to make, compared to a Hero System character.  Then again, most Hero System characters are not "first-level", this is (IMHO) both a draw for experienced players and a barrier to new players.  Even a higher-level D&D character is still simpler in choices (okay, next level... spend skill points here, roll for hit points, new feat, stat improvement).  I know players that take great enjoyment in planning their character's path all the way to level 20 when the character is first created.  I get that enjoyment.

On 2/11/2022 at 11:54 AM, Tasha said:

 
This is another instance where Hero Fans have shot the game in the foot. You set down a Hero System book ie Champions Complete or Fantasy Hero Complete. All you have done is handed a player two books with lots of flexibility, and like you said no guidelines for how to create characters. Even less given to GMs to create their own campaigns. Though admittedly there is GM support with NPC/ Villain books.

I would love to see something like a Pathfinder Adventure Path, with character generation that is simplified. Like with the Champions Character Gen Cards. Perhaps with each character type given a section, with Characteristics, prebuilt powers, Perks, Skill lists, Complications. Basically an On Rails version of character generation. With lots of customization, pared down, so it isn't anywhere near the full toolkit. Include options that players can buy with exp.

Also, decide an average power level for the characters (ie DC10, Dex 20, Spd 5 etc), and have Villains and NPCs built to challenge that power level.

Don't include the full power/abilities toolkit. Include with the PDFs, a supplement book that shows everything in their full Hero System Glory.

I think that would be an *excellent* way to bring in more new players, including D&D players.  👍

There are (again, IMHO) Hero books that are closer to that ideal than Champions Complete and Fantasy Hero Complete.  Narosia.  Widening Gyre.  Western Hero.  Not at that ideal, but closer.  Single books that can be used to run a campaign, with the setting and appropriate power levels.

Although for a supers RPG that is more D&D-like, Mighty Protectors (V&V 3.0) is closer than Hero System will ever be.

The more I think about it, the more I think you nailed it with this:  "Basically an On Rails version of character generation."  That's a basic difference between D&D and Hero System.  Players will, in general, prefer either a more constrained or more open character generation method (IMHO).

I did some looking and found that cool four-barrel pistol pictured on page 59.  It's a Remington Elliot ring four-barrel Derringer.  Chambered for .32 rimfire.  I couldn't find barrel length, but it looks to be ~3-1/2 - 4 inches. Also couldn't find out if the barrel was rifled, but I doubt that it was (although I don't know if that would make a difference in Hero stats).  It's double-action.  The barrels do not rotate; pulling the ring trigger forward rotates a single firing pin to the next barrel.

So I'd write it up same as the Pepperbox on page 68 except that it's .32, double-action instead of cap-and-ball, first available 1863.  

According to one source, these "were manufactured between 1863 - 1888 and about 17,500 were made in .32 rimfire" 

A good weapon for a gambler, or a good backup weapon for anyone.

On 10/28/2021 at 3:06 PM, Christopher R Taylor said:

Again, I have to thank everyone for their interest in and purchase of Western Hero.  I am honestly shocked about how many units are selling around the world.  I know its not D&D levels big time but its huge for me, and fits my thought that there was a lot of interest in an old west game setting.

 

Honestly it almost brings me to tears.  I have been working as hard as I can for years and it is so nice to see at least something sell really well for a while to make it seem as if I'm not just wasting my time.  Thank you all, everywhere.

You do great work, and I'm glad WH is selling so well. 👍

On 2/7/2022 at 12:21 PM, Tasha said:

Most arguments against it tend to boil down to "I am used to how it is, don't really want to change. So I don't see the point"

Exactly, since it's all the same math. So it's either "I'm used to it" for an experienced player, or "This way seems more intuitive/easy to me" for a noobie.

So for example "For Newbies who are likely to be coming from D&D it is very similar to the dominant mechanic there. aka Roll the Dice, add that number to the skill/stat modifer. compare it to the target number ie Armor Class. If you equal the Target number you succeed.  The only difference between D&D and roll high Hero system would be that you roll 3d6 instead of a D20." is an "I'm used to it" argument.

The way my brain works, I think the easiest method is:

[Roll low]  OCV plus one for every point you roll below 11 OR minus one for every point you roll above 11 = DCV you hit.

[Roll high]  OCV plus one for every point you roll above 10 OR minus one for every point you roll below 10 = DCV you hit.

Understood.  So is the intent KA 1d6 (4d6 w/STR)?

Christopher,

I'm going through Champions Begins.  Great work, and interesting idea of teaching Hero System in five steps!

Question on Crusher - The chapter 3 character sheet shows his Crush attack as "KA 1d6 (3d6 w/STR) vs PD, must follow grab" but his STR is 45 which would be a 4d6 attack.  And the hero designer writeup has it as an RKA and has AoE 6m (among other things).  What is the intent of the attack build?

An excellent example of a Galactic Champions campaign!  Huzzah for you and your players!

52 minutes ago, Grailknight said:

Buy a Linked Mind Scan that only works through remote sensors. It's fairly inexpensive and perfectly rules compliant.

I'm kind of torn on this.  One one hand, it's cleaner than my suggestion and I like that.  OTOH, you need to succeed with an MCV Attack roll and then roll > target's EGO on the effect dice and that feels wrong to me.

(I will note that as Mind Scan is a Sense, Grailknight and I are doing minor variations on the same theme.  Great minds... 😁 )

As part of the Telepathy Power, buy a Targeting Sense with as much range as you need (Spatial Awareness?), then limit it as "Only Through Closed Circuit TV" or whatever you want, and "Only To Establish LOS For Telepathy".

As a character can establish LOS with Targeting Senses other than Sight (6E1, 148) this provides a RAW legal method.

9 hours ago, LoneWolf said:

I don’t know about others, but I use a computer to make most of the rolls I need to make.  This allows me to make massive number of rolls and quickly determine how many succeed.  This is really helpful in situations where the players are facing a lot of low-level threats that they can mow through.

 

Heh.  [Off-topic]  we have multiple folks in our gaming group GM at some point.  One of them uses a huge plastic-box-subdivided-into-small-boxes-with-small-3d6-in-each-box to roll for mooks shooting at the heros (this is in a Golden Age Champions game).

GM: "The Nazi soldiers shoot" " :rolls box:  "They all miss"

I assume he's at least scanning for 3's (maybe 4's and 5's as well).

6 hours ago, schir1964 said:

I like this for one reason:

 

It keeps the relevant information partitioned off to only those people it's relevant to.

 

OCV + 3d6 is the relevant information for the player.

DCV + 10 is the relevant information for the game master.

 

I think I'll use this for the games I'm going run with my kids. One has already voiced that there appears to be a lot math (after reading the Champions Begins player manual).

This should make things even easier in game play.

 

 

This is why I like my group's method.

Look, there are a number of *mathematically equivalent* ways to do the to-hit roll.  They ultimately come down to "what is the easiest method for MY gaming group to understand"?  So use what's easiest for your group.

The way we do it keeps the information partitioned correctly (IMHO).  Player: "I hit a DCV of X." GM: "You hit/miss".

On 1/30/2022 at 7:18 PM, Duke Bushido said:

I think I'm going to start bookmarking these threads and just respond with a list of links. 

 

The survey is a nice touch, though.

 

My standing is still "no; I don't do it.  I have yet to find any argument that has convinced me that it is in any way better that the way we've been doing it for decades.

 

 

On a related note, though-- so I can add something constructive to the conversation:

 

I use the to-hit mechanic for Skill v Skill rolls, instead of the RAW way:

 

Okay, you're making a Concealment check to search the room.  The guy hiding the McGuffin had a 12-.  Let me make a quick roll....  he rolled an 8; that's four levels of success....

 

You have a 14- on your Concealment; make your roll....

 

Okay, you rolled a 10; that's four levels of success....

 

Spend ten minutes searching, describe what you're doing to increase your odds of finding something, and try again....

 

Alternatively, of course:

 

Okay, you have a 14 penalty because of the first guy's success, so you roll a 10...  yep.  You found it, barely.  This eliminates the potential for ties, of course, but my preference:

 

 

I use the to-hit roll as the mechanic:

 

Your 14 (or less) plus 11 minus the "defenders" 12-.  Roll 3d6  (apply any modifiers, of course).

 

It eliminates ties, and I use the "level of success" to determine just how long the search might have taken, roughly.

 

Anyone else do that?

 

 

My group does RAW for Skill vs. Skill rolls, and here's why I prefer it to your mechanic:

The first roll determines how well the first actor does.

Example:  Stealth vs. PER Roll.  If the stealthy character fails the roll, everyone hears it (the classic "steps on a branch and breaks it") and decides how to respond.  If the stealthy character makes the roll, the skill/vigilance of the opposition matters.

Also, I have been known to be motivated by a "SCUBA Snack"...

My group does it slightly differently:  the attacker still rolls.

11 + OCV -3d6 = DCV hit.

In your above example, PC "I attack God Monster".  Rolls 3d6 = 10.  11 + 8 - 10 = 9.  "I hit a DCV of 9".  GM "Prayer hits.  Roll damage".

GM "God Monster is peeved He attempts to attack Prayer."  Rolls 3d6 = 8.  11 + 7 - 8 = 10.  "God Monster hits a DCV 0f 10."  PC "Prayer is hit."

As an alternate, you roll and note where the roll is compared to 11.  For every point under 11, you hit that many points over your OCV.  For every point over 11, you hit than many points under your OCV.  If you roll 11, you hit your OCV.

Use the Active Points in the absorbed power - roll Normal Damage Body (1d6 per 5 Active Points)?

You're not wrong, Bazza...

1 hour ago, Lord Liaden said:

I see you kept your classic avatar.

 

I'll save you a rocking chair on my porch beside mine.

Yes, that is me (a *much* younger me now).

We can rock on the porch together and reminisce about the old days...

A modification from the Runequest Spirit Magic system simulation I did some years back...

Buy whatever base power you need (say, +1 SPD with one 5-minute Continuing Charge).

Then apply Usable By Others at (+1/4) to the base power with whatever limits you want as a Side Effect and other Limitations (like restrainable for the tattoos)

Thanks much, Christopher!

[So as not to further derail the RIP Meatloaf topic]

Hello, all you Hero old-timers! 😁 😘

SCUBA Hero here.  I've not been on the forums much, but want to start spending more time here again.

I am still with my long-term gaming group of mumble mumble years.  I've switched jobs and travel quite a bit, so I sometimes cannot attend the sessions, but I do when I can and enjoy it muchly.  The current campaign is golden age; I am playing a speedster named DoubleTime! (the exclamation point is in his name).  I've had a lot of fun running him.

Lots of names here I still recognize, and new friends to meet.  So say 'hi' here if you'd like and look for me around on the forums.

:waves:

Hello, all you Hero old-timers! 😁 😘

...and thanks, Pariah!