Star Trek (The Original Series): What's the Best Episode?

[Pattern Ghost]

15 minutes ago, Pariah said:

I have to say, I find interesting the degree to which the prequel series, i.e., Enterprise and Discovery, have made it a point to demonize the Vulcans in general and Spock specifically.

 

I don't think Roddenberry would have approved.

 

In Enemy Within, Kirk's bad half and good half are split apart into two Kirks by a transporter accident.

 

Bad Kirk brutally attempts to rape Yeoman Janice Rand.

 

At the end of the episode, Spock quips, "The imposter had some . . . interesting qualities . . . wouldn't you say, Yeoman?"

 

So, you be the judge.

 

As far as Discovery, they didn't really make any point of demonizing Spock that I could see. Other than saddling him with an adopted sister. Considering it was a massive ret-con, I think it was pretty well done. The animosity the siblings have kind of accounts for why Spock never really mentions her in TOS. And they all settle things amicably in the end. Sarek also comes off as a loving father, even.

[tkdguy]

1 hour ago, Pattern Ghost said:

Just finished Enemy Within. Spock's a dick. (Re: His quip at Rand at the end.)

 

I came to the same conclusion.

[Lord Liaden]

Spock always seemed to enjoy pointing out human faults and foibles, but early-episode Spock definitely could be snarkier about it, even wearing a little smirk a few times. His dignity and dispassion evolved as the series progressed.

[Pattern Ghost]

Yeah, he smiles and smirks quite a bit in the first few episodes, and clearly enjoys verbal back and forth with Kirk and McCoy. Definite work in progress.

 

I also hadn't remembered how flirtatious he really was with Uhura in the rec room scene in the Charlie X episode. Or that Uhura was blatantly flirting with him an the episode before that one. Apparently, they were pushing the network's boundaries on having a mixed race relationship as much as they dared, according to an interview I read with Nichols. And here I'd thought Abrams was just adding that element in to his AU Treks.

[Badger]

14 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

I did feel pity for Charlie Evans, because despite being physically adult he was obviously still a child. No training or experience in social context or emotional self-control, never having had to take responsibility for his actions, turned loose in an environment where he could do whatever he wanted without consequences. The result was inevitable. But all he really wanted was what he never had, acceptance and companionship from others like himself. And when that was finally in his grasp it was taken away.

Yeah, I know the why, just that making people dissapear from existence is always magnitudes worse than simple murder for me, it just gets hard to get past for me, whereas otherwise i would feel sympathy. 

[Badger]

10 hours ago, Pattern Ghost said:

 

In Enemy Within, Kirk's bad half and good half are split apart into two Kirks by a transporter accident.

 

Bad Kirk brutally attempts to rape Yeoman Janice Rand.

 

At the end of the episode, Spock quips, "The imposter had some . . . interesting qualities . . . wouldn't you say, Yeoman?"

 

So, you be the judge.

 

As far as Discovery, they didn't really make any point of demonizing Spock that I could see. Other than saddling him with an adopted sister. Considering it was a massive ret-con, I think it was pretty well done. The animosity the siblings have kind of accounts for why Spock never really mentions her in TOS. And they all settle things amicably in the end. Sarek also comes off as a loving father, even.

 

I dont know, I kind of always attributed it to 1960s sensibilities dissonance.  The first thing I always notice is:  if one is accused of attempted rape they would not be allowed in the room during victim questioning, in our time, captain or not.

[Pattern Ghost]

7 minutes ago, Badger said:

I dont know, I kind of always attributed it to 1960s sensibilities dissonance. 

 

True, more like Spock's writers and actor were dicks.

[Michael Hopcroft]

The episode was remade, almost note for note, in "The Squire of Gothos", where another childish godling plays around with mortals and tries bending them to his will before being called home. He did things like playing life-or-death games and making up the rules as he went along, like challenging Captain Kirk and the crew of the Enterprise to a loser-dies game of Calvinball. The difference is that the Squire is much more entertaining company -- he knows he's playing a game, and he seeks fun and enjoyment at all costs (and not caring about others at all). He was so much a proto-Q that some fans have a retcon that he is Q -- or at least a citizen of the Continuum.

 

The strength of TNG is the acting. They were fortunate to be able to cast one of the great Shakespeareans of his generation as the lead, a very good actor playing one of the most complex characters, and other members of the cast who recognized their limitations and worked diligently to improve them. Patrick Stewart's performances in "The Inner Light" and "Ensigns of Command" made those episodes sing.

 

 

[Lord Liaden]

20 hours ago, Badger said:

Yeah, I know the why, just that making people dissapear from existence is always magnitudes worse than simple murder for me, it just gets hard to get past for me, whereas otherwise i would feel sympathy. 

 

What crossed the line for me was when he erased that crew-woman's face because he was angry and didn't want to hear people laughing. That gave me nightmares when I first saw it as a kid. In comparison, making people simply disappear comes across as pretty clean and painless.

 

No question, Charlie X was a terrifying monster. But he was made into one by circumstances he couldn't understand.

[Badger]

Yeah, my mind kind of forgot the face thing, not sure I should thank you for reminding.🥺

 

But, yeah the erase existence thing I do realize is my religion inserting it self into analytical process.  As in: would the soul get erased too? 

 

Note: And yes there is some irony there since Roddenberry was atheist if I remember.   Still, my mind drifts there.

[Badger]

2 hours ago, Michael Hopcroft said:

The episode was remade, almost note for note, in "The Squire of Gothos", where another childish godling plays around with mortals and tries bending them to his will before being called home. He did things like playing life-or-death games and making up the rules as he went along, like challenging Captain Kirk and the crew of the Enterprise to a loser-dies game of Calvinball. The difference is that the Squire is much more entertaining company -- he knows he's playing a game, and he seeks fun and enjoyment at all costs (and not caring about others at all). He was so much a proto-Q that some fans have a retcon that he is Q -- or at least a citizen of the Continuum.

 

The strength of TNG is the acting. They were fortunate to be able to cast one of the great Shakespeareans of his generation as the lead, a very good actor playing one of the most complex characters, and other members of the cast who recognized their limitations and worked diligently to improve them. Patrick Stewart's performances in "The Inner Light" and "Ensigns of Command" made those episodes sing.

 

 

Given Trelane's parents came in the end. Maybe he was adolescent Q.

[DShomshak]

A friend of mine says that people are making homemade ST eps and posting them online. (Legal, as long as you don't try charging money, apparently.) One posits that Trelane is a Continuum child... and Q gets tasks as his babysitter. In desperation, he turns to the best-functioning adult he knows: He appears on the Enterprise, begging, "Picard, you've got to help me! This brat is driving me crazy!" And Picard laughs...

 

Dean Shomshak

 

 

[Lord Liaden]

The above plot and line are actually taken from a "non-canon" ST:TNG novel by Peter David, titled [i]Q-Squared[/i]. https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Q-Squared

[Pattern Ghost]

Shouldn't the title be "Q-Squired"?

[Old Man]

Yes. Or “Q-cubed” would have been more alliterative. 

[death tribble]

I wondered if anyone would make the Squire of Gothos connection. Well done Michael

[massey]

I felt sympathy for Charlie X, at the very end.  Make no mistake, I'd have phasered the little bastard in the back of the head at the first opportunity.  But when he starts panicking and pleading at the end, and you realize the sort of Hell he's going back to, you understand he was just a kid who was so emotionally damaged that he really couldn't help himself.  It's sort of like when they shoot Old Yeller at the end of the movie.  It has to be done, but it's still sad.

[DShomshak]

Speaking of scenes that look a bit more, hm, dubious to 2020 sensibilities, last night I watched :Dagger of the Mind." Kirk wants to test the mind machine MacGuffin, rightly thinking the insane asylum doctor is not being truthful with him. The lady scientist he's drafted to help him tries implanting a false memory that they had a passionate one-night stand. Um? If a guy did this to a woman, we'd probably call him a sexual predator.

 

Dean Shomshak

[Pattern Ghost]

I just finished the first season, and that was certainly the only episode I'd call out as a complete stinker. Most of the rest were at least OK, with the usual number of television/movie gaffs.

[Lord Liaden]

4 hours ago, DShomshak said:

Speaking of scenes that look a bit more, hm, dubious to 2020 sensibilities, last night I watched :Dagger of the Mind." Kirk wants to test the mind machine MacGuffin, rightly thinking the insane asylum doctor is not being truthful with him. The lady scientist he's drafted to help him tries implanting a false memory that they had a passionate one-night stand. Um? If a guy did this to a woman, we'd probably call him a sexual predator.

 

Dean Shomshak

 

I agree, the issue was not viewed with the same sensitivity then. However, I've frequently noticed from women in the present day, sexually aggressive behavior toward men that would be considered unacceptable were their genders reversed. There seems to be an underlying assumption among women that a woman is allowed to do that to a man. Maybe it's a sense that it's justice, or payback, conscious or unconscious.

 

If nothing else, that episode does remind us that given the power, women can be just as exploiting as men.

[Pattern Ghost]

2 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

If nothing else, that episode does remind us that given the power, women can be just as exploiting as men.

 

She never showed any signs of trying to exploit Kirk. More like playing with him to test the machine, and a little wish fulfillment in the process. When the mustache-twirling villain amps it up, she rejects Kirk's advances out of a normal sense of decency. Her intent there seemed more playful to me.

[Lord Liaden]

I agree that that's what the writers of the scene intended to convey. But as Dean Shomshak pointed out above, in the present day it probably wouldn't be interpreted that way. And that excuse wouldn't wash with today's viewers if Kirk switched roles with her.

 

But you're right, "exploit" probably isn't the best word to describe altering someone's memories according to one's whim. "Violate" would be more suitable.

[massey]

2 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

 

I agree, the issue was not viewed with the same sensitivity then. However, I've frequently noticed from women in the present day, sexually aggressive behavior toward men that would be considered unacceptable were their genders reversed. There seems to be an underlying assumption among women that a woman is allowed to do that to a man. Maybe it's a sense that it's justice, or payback, conscious or unconscious.

 

If nothing else, that episode does remind us that given the power, women can be just as exploiting as men.

 

Several years ago, a local official got a little boob grabby at his office Christmas party.  The women I worked with were furious.  They wanted him prosecuted.  He should be a sex offender for life.  We all knew the victim, and fortunately for that guy, she was very forgiving of everything and it ended with him only losing his job.  When I suggested that maybe that was punishment enough, I was told repeatedly (and loudly) about how this was a huge violation and men like that need to be arrested.

 

That summer our office went to a conference out of town, with the all-important phrase "open bar".  After a bunch of drinks, three of those same women felt empowered enough to grab my ass/lick my ear/press their breasts into my chest, all with zero prompting from me (actually I think the three instances might have been spread out at parties/conferences throughout the year).

 

Well if you think I'd pick digging up an old argument and gloating about it instead of getting laid with a drunken coworker... you'd be right.  That's exactly what I did.  And they were not very appreciative, I can tell you that.