General Sports Thread

[aylwin13]

6 hours ago, Logan.1179 said:

Exhibit number 1 in the case of Soccer is Dumb

Yup. No 'extra time' periods or penalty kicks in playoff matches. Golden goal (sudden death) needs to be brought back.

[Spence]

On 11/24/2021 at 9:27 AM, Logan.1179 said:

Exhibit number 1 in the case of Soccer is Dumb

 

On 11/24/2021 at 3:43 PM, aylwin13 said:

Yup. No 'extra time' periods or penalty kicks in playoff matches. Golden goal (sudden death) needs to be brought back.

 

And yet stopping play 3 hours into a 60 minute game for a commercial time out just builds excitement.........

 

[unclevlad]

Golden Goal was removed because games occasionally lasted *forever*.  What's the average number of total goals in a competitive soccer game...3?  And in sudden death, how many teams draw back into a shell?  So how long would games go?  This isn't like hockey;  the Stanley Cup playoffs use sudden death.  But each side generally has 5-7 shots on goal each period.  I know there've been some VERY long hockey games, but not that many.

It's not like the shootout is new...altho I didn't realize just how far back it went.  1976 in the Europeans;  1977 in World Cup qualifying.

 

No, it's not gonna happen...at least not without major changes to the substitution rules.  in a tournament situation, both teams are put at a major disadvantage due to fatigue;  in hockey, unless it was the series clincher, there were substitutions throughout, and both teams will be in more or less the same shape for the next game.  The soccer situation is closer to the tennis situation rather than hockey, since the active players are stuck playing throughout.  OK, we'll likely NEVER see another Isner-Mahout (71-69 (!!!!!!) in the 5th, 11 hours played out over 3 days...McEnroe later opined it probably took 6 months off each player's career) but every event uses tiebreaks for most sets;  of the Slams, the US and Aussie Opens have tie breaks at 6 all in the 5th.  The French and Wimbledon have their own rules, but I'm pretty sure there's pressure on the French to switch.  Wimbledon does a tiebreaker at 12 all;  there's some pressure to back off that to a degree, but at least it IS limited.

Nah.  They'll never revert completely to "next goal only."  There's no stakeholder that would benefit.

[slikmar]

I agree that the Golden Goal should be used, because in a game that goals are at such a premium, to do 2 15 minute periods, regardless of whether one team scores or not is just insane. how many extra time games have we seen where one team scores in first OT and then has to hold on for 20+ minutes.

[death tribble]

Lewis Hamilton wins the Saudi Arabia Grand Prix which means the last Grand Prix will be the decider.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/59542213

 

Zhao Xintong wins the UK Snooker Championship

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/snooker/59540759

[unclevlad]

19 hours ago, slikmar said:

I agree that the Golden Goal should be used, because in a game that goals are at such a premium, to do 2 15 minute periods, regardless of whether one team scores or not is just insane. how many extra time games have we seen where one team scores in first OT and then has to hold on for 20+ minutes.

 

I wouldn't have a problem with a 30 minute maximum Golden Goal period, then penalty kicks.  I just don't want the potentially unlimited extra time, not when scoring chances, much less goals, are so infrequent.

[Pariah]

When the NHL goes to overtime, they also remove a player from each team, so that it's four on four instead of five on five. What if soccer were to go seven on seven instead of 10 on 10?

[Cancer]

Red cards earlier in the game interact with that in ways that seem less than optimal.  A team playing shorthanded has that disadvantage augmented if you take 3 people each side off (which is the way it would have to be done).

[unclevlad]

That's a very good point;  Mr. P's idea would at least open up the field.

 

Red cards are incredibly harsh penalties, tho.  Not only an ejection but not allowed to replace.  It's the only sport I know of, where that's the case.   Well, team sport...the equivalents in, say, boxing or tennis (Djokovic accidentally striking a ball kid with an angrily-swatted ball) are You Lose.  But those are individual sports, so clearly, if the individual does something that bad, there's not a whole lot else that can be done.

 

Besides, the purists would scream at that too.  7 on 7?  That's not soccer!!!  Every sport has a major, frequently dominating, reactionary faction opposed to practically ANY change;  that faction has become more and more dug in over the years.  Tennis...many events had no linespeople this year.  Gosh, it was GREAT!  Practically no arguments, no need to appeal.  Then some of the *&@#($&)!(@#&_%(&@*(&$_%*@*(^Y_#*$&$ clay court events with linesmen and NO replay "because the replay system isn't accurate enough" and they point to STUPID MARKS ON THE COURT!!!  MUCH LESS accurate.  Baseball...the runner at 2nd in extra innings was a great adaptation to cut down on the sheer BOREDOM because every batter was swinging for the fences practically every time, and games lasted *forever* with nothing going on.  But that's going bye-bye, I believe.  "It's not baseball!  It messes up all our stats!!!!"  WAHHH!!!  HATE that head-in-the-sand argument.  

 

It's actually interesting that hockey did pull it off.  3 on 3 is cool.  It's not 4 on 4 now, they pull *2* skaters.
Oh, but guess what?  They play that way ALL YEAR...but not in the playoffs.  <sigh>

[Pariah]

Athletes and coaches will still attend, diplomats and dignitaries will not. 

 

Citing 'ongoing genocide,' Biden announces diplomatic boycott of 2022 Beijing Olympics

[Cygnia]

Kentucky Derby winner Medina Spirit dies while training at Santa Anita Park

[Logan D. Hurricanes]

Wow. Did not see that coming. 😲

[slikmar]

17 hours ago, unclevlad said:

Besides, the purists would scream at that too.  7 on 7?

Just look at how long it has taken Rugby 7s to truly be recognized, though i would say it is a much more enjoyable version to watch. 15s are just too crowded.

[unclevlad]

I've seen rugby 7's occasionally, and yeah, it's an interesting-looking game.  Full-squad is just a grind, altho I'll grant, I can't recall seeing any in...ages.  

 

But that's also a change from the start, and recognized as a separate form.  So that's less unacceptable, if you'll pardon the double negative, than an overtime-only change.  It's probably on par with the college football overtime rule, of alternating possession from the 25.  NOT as bad as the new rule, where starting with the 3rd overtime, it's 2-point conversion plays ONLY.  Possession at the 25 leaves most of the game intact.

[Cancer]

Yeah, you have to avoid fundamentally changing the game.  As amusing as some of our old ideas about introducing defense into billiards (there are two circles, each 20' from the center of the table, the defender gets his choice of which to stand in on each shot, and the defense consists of throwing a hand towel at the table from the circle) and golf (you get a bugle, and you can stand no closer than 20 feet from your opponent, and can blow the bugle once as he makes his approach and swing on a shot), they do change those games.  Which was part of the point ....

[unclevlad]

You can change the game.  Just don't imply it's the old game;  keep it 100% separate.  That's why rugby 7's is OK.  Or indoor soccer;  that's not a bad game to watch, because the playing surface is small.

 

On Medina Spirit:  a full examination is required in all such cases in California, by the story I saw earlier...and probably in most states with horse racing.  So we shall see.  After the doping problem at the Derby, Baffert probably won't get more than a nominal presumption of innocence.

 

Plus there's almost certainly a major insurance claim that'll need to be settled.  The horse was a stallion, and his stud fees...Derby winner, 2nd in Breeder's Cup...would've been VERY substantial.

[Michael Hopcroft]

On 12/5/2021 at 2:59 PM, Pariah said:

When the NHL goes to overtime, they also remove a player from each team, so that it's four on four instead of five on five. What if soccer were to go seven on seven instead of 10 on 10?

Minor correction: NHL overtimes are now 3-on-3 plus the goalie.

[Spence]

On 12/4/2021 at 6:18 PM, slikmar said:

I agree that the Golden Goal should be used, because in a game that goals are at such a premium, to do 2 15 minute periods, regardless of whether one team scores or not is just insane. how many extra time games have we seen where one team scores in first OT and then has to hold on for 20+ minutes.

No, not insane.  Just not your preference.

It has been that way for a while and teams are familiar with it, so it is no surprise.

The majority of games end at the official overtime, some will end with a shootout.

 

A more beneficial would be to eliminate all Time Outs and time stopping from gridiron and force them to play a 60 minute game in 60 minutes.  

Or better yet bring ball Ironman Football, now that would be worth seeing

 

 

[Pariah]

No good deed goes unpunished.

 

Chelsea's Sam Kerr body checks pitch invader to turf, gets punished for it

[unclevlad]

3 hours ago, Pariah said:

No good deed goes unpunished.

 

Chelsea's Sam Kerr body checks pitch invader to turf, gets punished for it

 

The security personnel should get raked over the coals...where were they???  But unless it's self defense, or protecting someone else, no...the player simply cannot hit the idiot.  I'd actually argue that the ref was being (IMO properly) lenient in making it ONLY a yellow card.  It could've been a red card very easily.

 

The moron deserves some minor jail time.  Security needs to be reviewed, and *possibly* some people need to be fired.  But that still doesn't make the player's action right.

[Pariah]

Yeah, okay, I can see that. I grudgingly accept your entirely fair and reasonable assessment of the situation.

 

Still, there's a part of me that would like to buy that lady a drink, except for the fact that

A ) I don't drink,

B ) She's in another country where they play the wrong kind of football, and 

C ) Lady P would object in a rather strenuous and painful (to me) manner. 

[Cygnia]

Al Unser Sr., four-time winner of Indianapolis 500, dies at 82

[Spence]

On 12/9/2021 at 1:19 PM, unclevlad said:

 

The security personnel should get raked over the coals...where were they???  But unless it's self defense, or protecting someone else, no...the player simply cannot hit the idiot.  I'd actually argue that the ref was being (IMO properly) lenient in making it ONLY a yellow card.  It could've been a red card very easily.

 

The moron deserves some minor jail time.  Security needs to be reviewed, and *possibly* some people need to be fired.  But that still doesn't make the player's action right.

 

On 12/9/2021 at 2:08 PM, Pariah said:

Yeah, okay, I can see that. I grudgingly accept your entirely fair and reasonable assessment of the situation.

 

Still, there's a part of me that would like to buy that lady a drink, except for the fact that

A ) I don't drink,

B ) She's in another country where they play the wrong kind of football, and 

C ) Lady P would object in a rather strenuous and painful (to me) manner. 

 

Hmmm....

 

I always thought they should have a special response teams for all sports that that use leather straps to beat the intruder viciously as long as they remain in the boundary of the field.

And then charge them $100,000 per minute for lost game time.

 

I guarantee you that the second time it was enforced you would no longer see this garbage any more.  

The first time to go to court and have the trespasser fined another $100,000 in addition for "wasting the time of the court".   

 

Once people know there will be painful repercussions and then also realize that there is no way to avoid the consequences they will stop.

 

 

[unclevlad]

3 minutes ago, Spence said:

I always thought they should have a special response teams for all sports that that use leather straps to beat the intruder viciously as long as they remain in the boundary of the field.

And then charge them $100,000 per minute for lost game time.

 

I guarantee you that the second time it was enforced you would no longer see this garbage any more.  

The first time to go to court and have the trespasser fined another $100,000 in addition for "wasting the time of the court".   

 

Once people know there will be painful repercussions and then also realize that there is no way to avoid the consequences they will stop.

 

 

Yeah, but it'd be illegal as all heck to beat the guy.  The fine can't be levied by the team against a fan, it'd have to be part of the punishment for the crime.  A civil case, OTOH, might be possible.  THAT would get REAL expensive, REAL fast, for the dimwit who ran onto the field.  But would the negative PR be worse?  

 

Personally?  10 days in jail fits.  Even if it's 5 weekends.  I'm fine with that.  I think it's better than a fine.  I've never been in jail, but I think for your average middle-class suburban, sheltered kiddy, the shock would be enormous.  

 

But here's a consideration.  Yeah, if you could beat the guy *on camera* and it was allowed, that would be a general deterrent.  But that's massively excessive force, absent a clear, physical threat.  I think the 10 days in jail will stop *that* perp...but it does nothing to stop the next one, who's blissfully ignorant.  The idiots who walk onto a playing field are generally drunk, or some form of completely self-centered git.  It's not about right and wrong because that doesn't even enter their heads.  It's just another way to get on social media...how cool is that???  So they DARN sure can't comprehend consequences.

 

The goal needs to be discouraging people from ever coming on the field...but in this culture, that's hard to do.  

[Pariah]

46 minutes ago, unclevlad said:

The goal needs to be discouraging people from ever coming on the field...but in this culture, that's hard to do.  

 

I don't know, an understanding that a player on the playing field could bodycheck me with impunity would certainly discourage me from wanting to go on. Which kind of brings me back to my original post, I suppose.