unclevlad Posted February 17, 2022 Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 41 minutes ago, Cancer said: The Olympics impinge so little on my personal reality that I was completely surprised by the images on the multiple walls of TVs at the Costco about an hour ago. We already know you live in your own personal universe, man. Cancer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cancer Posted February 17, 2022 Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 Life's just better here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pariah Posted February 17, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 Can't say I'm sad to hear this. Kamila Valieva, ROC skater, falls multiple times, finishes fourth in women's final In other news, the USA women's hockey team lost only their second game of the tournament, falling 3-2 to Canada in the gold medal game. (Their other loss was also to Canada, 4-2.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnia Posted February 17, 2022 Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 Russian Figure Skater at Center of Doping Scandal Falters on Centerstage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted February 17, 2022 Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 15 minutes ago, Pariah said: Can't say I'm sad to hear this. Kamila Valieva, ROC skater, falls multiple times, finishes fourth in women's final I'm angry that she was allowed to compete, in multiple events, after they knew she'd broken the doping rules. Pariah 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclevlad Posted February 17, 2022 Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 2 hours ago, archer said: I'm angry that she was allowed to compete, in multiple events, after they knew she'd broken the doping rules. Not their call. Court for Arbitration in Sports said, let her. From what I read, I'm not sure the whole process had run its course, and that was a factor. So was her age. To me, one noteworthy aspect of this is that the process bites. it's too slow. Not like this is unusual. On the human side, tho...an aspect of the CAS ruling was that not letting her compete could do her irreparable harm. Yes, well, it's not a reach to suggest the criticism weighed on her. She messed up early and lost it completely...it happens. Especially in skating and gymnastics, and even moreso in the Russian programs. (The 17 year old who took the silver was SERIOUSLY upset she didn't get gold. Yes, she's Russian.) So, how much damage will THIS result do to her, long term? And I don't think this is pure hindsight. IMO the system failed everyone involved. Pariah 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted February 17, 2022 Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 27 minutes ago, unclevlad said: Not their call. Court for Arbitration in Sports said, let her. From what I read, I'm not sure the whole process had run its course, and that was a factor. So was her age. To me, one noteworthy aspect of this is that the process bites. it's too slow. Not like this is unusual. On the human side, tho...an aspect of the CAS ruling was that not letting her compete could do her irreparable harm. Yes, well, it's not a reach to suggest the criticism weighed on her. She messed up early and lost it completely...it happens. Especially in skating and gymnastics, and even moreso in the Russian programs. (The 17 year old who took the silver was SERIOUSLY upset she didn't get gold. Yes, she's Russian.) So, how much damage will THIS result do to her, long term? And I don't think this is pure hindsight. IMO the system failed everyone involved. From what I understand about the case, the CAS was notified in February, after she'd already competed in the Olympics, then the CAS ruled on Sunday. The drug test she failed was last Christmas and the IOC was notified about the failed drug test at that time. The apparent lag time so that she could compete despite failing the test, or having to first face the CAS, is one of my problems with what happened. Maybe I'm misunderstanding the sequence of events. The other problem I have is her (supposedly) taking her grandfather's drugs. It is very simple to not take someone else's drugs. You don't pick up their drugs then you don't swallow their drugs. If you have drugs of your own, you don't mix them with other people's drugs. If she's old enough to compete in the Olympics, she's old enough to know not to swallow random pills which she comes across. And particularly since she's an Olympian who has been warned repeatedly for years that there's drugs which she's not allowed to swallow since she's a competitive athlete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pariah Posted February 17, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 8 minutes ago, archer said: The other problem I have is her (supposedly) taking her grandfather's drugs. Yeah, I don't believe this explanation from the ROC for the briefest fraction of a second. She just happened to take some of her grandfather's medication, which in conjunction with other (legal, or at least not banned) stuff she's been taking just happens to result in increased oxygen uptake and greater endurance? That seem like an awfully large burden to place on the back of poor Coincidence. There's a game I learned some time ago that I still find useful. It's called "Which Is More Likely?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archer Posted February 17, 2022 Report Share Posted February 17, 2022 12 minutes ago, Pariah said: Yeah, I don't believe this explanation from the ROC for the briefest fraction of a second. She just happened to take some of her grandfather's medication, which in conjunction with other (legal, or at least not banned) stuff she's been taking just happens to result in increased oxygen uptake and greater endurance? That seem like an awfully large burden to place on the back of poor Coincidence. There's a game I learned some time ago that I still find useful. It's called "Which Is More Likely?" She's a minor. And minors really shouldn't sit in a corner playing with Occam's Razor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slikmar Posted February 18, 2022 Report Share Posted February 18, 2022 And, of course, the whole reason there is an ROC is because Russian can't have a team for crap just like this. Now they have succeeded in tainting the ROC, because if a 15 year old figure skater is having this done to her, why should we believe any of the others aren't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclevlad Posted February 19, 2022 Report Share Posted February 19, 2022 So, a British Olympic relay team was stripped of its silver medal today. A medal earned in *Tokyo*. OK, it was last summer rather than 2020, but still. First, the decision was confirmed by the CAS back in November. 3 months? At best that feels like the upper bound of acceptable. But it wasn't announced until now. WHY??? These guys move almost as slowly as the NCAA. Another point about Valieva is concerns about how Russian coaches are treating their competitors. Valieva got *reamed*. The silver medalist felt so much pressure...and that has to start with the coaches...that she still felt like quitting, well after the initial disappointment. Now of course, one can argue whether our standards should be imposable on them. But...geeze, 15? What is acceptable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hopcroft Posted February 19, 2022 Report Share Posted February 19, 2022 I have always called figure skating "the cruel game" and wondered why young teens and even prepubescent children are thrown into that pressure cooker. It's the perfect way to break your child. Most top-level sporting systems that involved young teens like Vlieva have a tendency to be horribly abusive. I did not see the event, but reports of the coach's behavior spark so much outrage that I feel she should be up on charges for felony child abuse. Many programs in other Olympic sports are as bad or even much, much worse. If there is a point to crippling young bodies and psyches for a moment of fleeting glory that will be forgotten two weeks later, what is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
death tribble Posted February 19, 2022 Report Share Posted February 19, 2022 We finally got our first medal of the Winter Olympics. A silver medal in the men's curling. We are going to get at least another silver in the women's curling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pariah Posted February 19, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2022 10 hours ago, Michael Hopcroft said: If there is a point to crippling young bodies and psyches for a moment of fleeting glory that will be forgotten two weeks later, what is it? Besides the glory of Mother Russia, you mean? It's all propaganda. Russia is still running on the same toxic mix of machismo and a thinly-veiled inferiority complex that the old USSR rode for seven decades. Individuals don't matter in the service of the State. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnia Posted February 19, 2022 Report Share Posted February 19, 2022 The paranoid cynic in me is wondering if this poor girl might "accidentally" fall out a window back in Russia when the games are over... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclevlad Posted February 19, 2022 Report Share Posted February 19, 2022 1 hour ago, Cygnia said: The paranoid cynic in me is wondering if this poor girl might "accidentally" fall out a window back in Russia when the games are over... Probably not, but what's happened in the past is bad enough. Think Dan Ackroyd in Trading Places. That pretty much HAS happened if you fail. Gymnastics, skating, and chess for the USSR, for sure; swimming for East Germany. It's not pretty. Also, don't think it doesn't happen here. It's only VERY recently that verbal abuse started getting called out at the college level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
death tribble Posted February 19, 2022 Report Share Posted February 19, 2022 Belgium win first Gold medal at Winter Olympics in 74 years https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/winter-olympics/60445999 Norway have won their 15th Winter Olympics Gold medal which is a new record as the previous best was 14 in 2014. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/winter-olympics/60428141 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnia Posted February 19, 2022 Report Share Posted February 19, 2022 1 hour ago, unclevlad said: Probably not, but what's happened in the past is bad enough. Think Dan Ackroyd in Trading Places. That pretty much HAS happened if you fail. Gymnastics, skating, and chess for the USSR, for sure; swimming for East Germany. It's not pretty. Also, don't think it doesn't happen here. It's only VERY recently that verbal abuse started getting called out at the college level. Hell, I KNOW it happens here. The number of toxic parents and coaches I had to deal with (including my own damn father) during frelling intramural soccer of all things (back in the 80's). Not even for a HIGH SCHOOL team and they're pulling that "Winning is the ONLY THING!" BS... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grailknight Posted February 20, 2022 Report Share Posted February 20, 2022 6 hours ago, Cygnia said: The paranoid cynic in me is wondering if this poor girl might "accidentally" fall out a window back in Russia when the games are over... Depends, if she rebounds mentally they can get 2 or 3 more Olympics out of her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
death tribble Posted February 20, 2022 Report Share Posted February 20, 2022 Britain win Gold in the Women's Curling at the Olympics https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/winter-olympics/60451924 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan D. Hurricanes Posted February 20, 2022 Report Share Posted February 20, 2022 Finnish Skier Remi Lindholm Suffers 'Frozen' Penis In Winter Olympics Cross-Country Race Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pariah Posted February 20, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2022 To my considerable surprise and delight, the Russians were denied the men's ice hockey gold medal by Finland. As they used to say back in the old country, "Ruck the Fusskies". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unclevlad Posted February 21, 2022 Report Share Posted February 21, 2022 Another side of the Valieva issue. Note that this applies to gymnastics as well, most likely. (Going back to Olga Korbut.) https://www.huffpost.com/entry/figure-skating-eating-disorders-body-image-winter-olympics_n_6212196ce4b0f2c343f599cc On the skier: I caught parts of the biathlon, snowboarding, and ski jumps here and there, and yeah, the weather was COLD. The fact that it was shortened greatly is a compelling argument. Last for now:https://www.huffpost.com/entry/olympics-troubled-ioc_n_62128a5ee4b0f93b261a18c8 Key point: viewership was down 42% from 2018...also in Asia, so the time differential issues wouldn't be new. And apparently 2018 didn't do great either. We brought this up earlier, and...yes, if permanent sites can't be found, I think the Winter Games is in serious trouble, and the Summer Games not that much better off...they're SO MUCH bigger and more expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan D. Hurricanes Posted February 21, 2022 Report Share Posted February 21, 2022 Erin Jackson, the first Black American woman to medal in speed skating, is from the nearby town of Ocala. Just found that out tonight. Not paying much attention to the Beijing Olympics, so this was a pleasant surprise. Especially since you don't think "winter Olympics" and "Ocala, FL" in the same thought. But I guess if Tampa can win two Stanley Cups, anything goes now. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTM3qtGvOjg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnia Posted February 21, 2022 Report Share Posted February 21, 2022 Quote Kentucky Derby Winner Medina Spirit Stripped Of Title Over Drug Test Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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