JmOz Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 We all have little tricks we like to use, things that many would say should not be done, so the question is what abuses to the system do you like to use? My GM likes to give High Armor with Albative Body only ( as very few attacks will do 20 Body...) One of my new favorites involves martial arts (Especialy ranged): Choose one attack manuver that is your default (Defencive shot is a personal favorite), now you can use this one manuver with find weakness, your PSL's & CSL's, etc... esentialy anywhere where one attack is cheaper. Now assosiate a MP with the MA (A Quiver of trick arrows), all your slots benefit from the MA... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Skill pools. There's a reason they are only quasi-legal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CourtFool Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 OSLs Overall Skill Levels. You could argue they are not really abusive...until you get about 10 of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddHat Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses "Abuse" is going to be very subjective. Still, as far as favorite abuse is concerned, I'm guilty of using Mega-PRE characters both in games and against my players. It's amazing what a PRE of 75 or so can acomplish in most campaigns, especially with plenty of points in social skills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edsel Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses My favorite (grossly abusive) is buying Dispel vs. Knockback resistance, Does Knockback. It's cheap to buy lots of dice and send the enemy flying. Another is Clinging, Usable as an attack. You can just "paste" the enemy to the ground. If you knock them down they'll be stuck in a prone position. Mentalists with things like X-Ray vision can be really unbalancing. Then you can just dump 200 points into PRE and get everybody to surrender upon seeing you. There's lots of abuses. As a GM I've had some people come up with very clever abuses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Neilson Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Soeaking of Clinging, seems to me a Brick with a Clinging Damage Shield gets quite the effect, especially for those scrawny little martial artists that keep bouncing around them. And that is by the book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metaphysician Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Yep, anything that prevents dodging is killer against dodge-based defenses. Speaking of defense, the White Knight Defense combo ( damage reduction + damage absorbtion ). Damage reduction improves the effeciency of the absorbtion, the absorbtion provides bigger benefit that just sticking on lots of defense, and the combo all but nullifies AP, Pen, and NND. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checkmate Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses My GM likes to give High Armor with Albative Body only ( as very few attacks will do 20 Body...) One of my new favorites involves martial arts (Especialy ranged): Choose one attack manuver that is your default (Defencive shot is a personal favorite), now you can use this one manuver with find weakness, your PSL's & CSL's, etc... esentialy anywhere where one attack is cheaper. Now assosiate a MP with the MA (A Quiver of trick arrows), all your slots benefit from the MA... Wow that's just mean man. I used to think I could powergame with the best of them, but I'm not even in the same league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Hiemforth Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Soeaking of Clinging, seems to me a Brick with a Clinging Damage Shield gets quite the effect, especially for those scrawny little martial artists that keep bouncing around them. And that is by the book. Only if you buy it Usable As Attack too. Damage Shield can only be applied to Attack Powers. However, you can get just as nasty with a brick that has an Entangle Damage Shield... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCUBA Hero Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses The one that Champsguy promoted me to Junior Munchkin for: Brick STR 60 First Knuckle 1d6 HA Second Knuckle 1d6 HA Third Knuckle 1d6 HA Fourth Knuckle 1d6 HA Voila! A 12d6 plus 4 x 13d6 attacks in a Multipower Attack! (grumble) It's a bit less abusive since the new rule in (where is it ) that says that END for STR must be paid for each attack, even though the base rule clearly states that a character only pays END for STR ONCE per phase, REGARDLESS of how much he does with it! [/rant] Not that hard to get around, though. For an extra 30 points, slap 0 END on STR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted August 31, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Wow that's just mean man. I used to think I could powergame with the best of them' date=' but I'm not even in the same league.[/quote'] Which one? Mine or my GM's, I have to admit that when my GM showed me the Armor trick I went WOW... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildcat Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses I once had a PC do this to me, and now I'm much better at spotting these type of things. He had an Earth Elemental character with the following powers (no all of thim are listed just the ones relevent to this post) Tunneling - Closed behind Usable as an attack @ Range Detect anyone/thing on the surface of the ground As a sense, Ranged, Targeting, Discrimintory LS: Breath underground So I bet you can all see where this was heading... But on his hand writen Char sheet it wasn't so obvious with them all spaced out... Yeah he sunk into the ground, then startign pulling Agents under the ground about 3" then lft them there. Eash Phase he would nab another one... with NO chance of ever beening seen let alone targeted & attacked. & even if they did somehow find him he was protected by 3" of ground... Not an easy thing to blast through in 1 hit before he'd just move. He used that once... But I still use the Story as what NOT to do. WC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted August 31, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses "Abuse" is going to be very subjective. Still, as far as favorite abuse is concerned, I'm guilty of using Mega-PRE characters both in games and against my players. It's amazing what a PRE of 75 or so can acomplish in most campaigns, especially with plenty of points in social skills. Try puting it in a mentalists MP...saves points, fits the F/X (mild mind control) and can be down right terrifing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted August 31, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses The one that Champsguy promoted me to Junior Munchkin for: Brick STR 60 First Knuckle 1d6 HA Second Knuckle 1d6 HA Third Knuckle 1d6 HA Fourth Knuckle 1d6 HA Voila! A 12d6 plus 4 x 13d6 attacks in a Multipower Attack! (grumble) It's a bit less abusive since the new rule in (where is it ) that says that END for STR must be paid for each attack, even though the base rule clearly states that a character only pays END for STR ONCE per phase, REGARDLESS of how much he does with it! [/rant] Not that hard to get around, though. For an extra 30 points, slap 0 END on STR. Junior munchkin...Jm...I wonder... God I miss Champsguy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zed-F Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Anything with a big Side Effects associated with a almost-never-fails RSR. Accessible foci or restrainable powers, on a high-STR brick (or a char with access to high STR.) Misuse of lims. For instance, using lims meant for heroic games in superheroic games (such as Independent, STR minimums, etc.) or taking an expendability lim for a focus that is irreplacable but not actually expendable (i.e. it doesn't disappear when you use it.) In general, any power with more than +2 worth of advantages exceeding needs to be looked at closely. There are of course lots of others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Neilson Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Anything with a big Side Effects associated with a almost-never-fails RSR. That reminds me of a character I recall seeing once. Had RSR on pretty much everything. Skimming the sheet, he could do the following with 17- skill rolls: 1st phase: All defense powers and some skill levels 2nd Phase: More skill levels 3rd Phase: any combination of powers likely to ever be relevant. Not too limiting for a 1/3 point savings on pretty much all powers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinecone Posted August 31, 2004 Report Share Posted August 31, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses I try real hard to Not be abusive ...but I almost always have an AP attack if my character has Find weakness.......I know.... I'm bad......but I do try..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffreyWKramer Posted September 1, 2004 Report Share Posted September 1, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses I try real hard to Not be abusive ...but I almost always have an AP attack if my character has Find weakness.......I know.... I'm bad......but I do try..... In my opinion, that's an instance where your GM is bad for not imvoking the simple "just say no" principle. Alternately, I've known GMs who rule that there is no added effect from the first Find Weakness check if applied to Armor Piercing. To me, though, in most campaigns, allowing FW with AP is more or less equivalent to allowing NND KAs that do Body damage, with the defense defined as something like "being covered with grape jello." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BNakagawa Posted September 1, 2004 Report Share Posted September 1, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses I try real hard to Not be abusive ...but I almost always have an AP attack if my character has Find weakness.......I know.... I'm bad......but I do try..... Hrrm. AP attacks aren't as unbalancing with FW as just raw damage attacks. You're trading 1/3 of your attack dice for 1/4 of his defenses. Generally not a good trade. Even worse if you make your FW roll multiple times. Might be better at leaking a body pip or two on a KA, but you could just use penetrating for that. $0.02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Hiemforth Posted September 1, 2004 Report Share Posted September 1, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses You're trading 1/3 of your attack dice for 1/4 of his defenses. Generally not a good trade.Yeah, I agree. I'd classify buying both AP and FW on the same attack more as "wasting points" than "abusive." Now, if your GM let you buy the AP as a naked advantage, then put it and the Find Weakness in a Multipower together, so you could use the AP against foes with Lack of Weakness, and the Find Weakness against foes with Hardened Defenses... now that would be abusive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Jogger Posted September 1, 2004 Report Share Posted September 1, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Before Megascale, having the extra huge ultra slot in the multipower for teleport with lots of non-combat multiples. You see, teleport had no acceleration/deceleration problems when you have 12 or more doublings. It is half as slow as Flight since you always have to prep for another long-range teleport. But, if this really bothers you, you can add another non-combat for another 5 points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christougher Posted September 1, 2004 Report Share Posted September 1, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses OIF, Always On. -1 Lots of Linkeds. Usually to an OHID Elemental Control. Always On, Only in Hero ID. -3/4 IIF when not in Use, OIF when in use. -3/4 Powers with -2 or more in limitations that can still be used without serious problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmOz Posted September 1, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 1, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses WOW, you actualy past those off on a GM? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kolava Posted September 1, 2004 Report Share Posted September 1, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses IIF when not in Use, OIF when in use. -3/4 Actually, I sort of like this one. What's wrong with it? Edit: Oh, didn't notice the cost. What about an IAF/OAF for -3/4? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorItron Posted September 1, 2004 Report Share Posted September 1, 2004 Re: Favorite Abuses Back in the olden days before I started to GM (and realized how abusive this is), many of my characters had autofire and area effect on unusual attacks (ego blast, NNDs, drains, tiny RKA with the penetrating advantage, etc.). 5th ed. rightfully increased the cost of such builds, but they can still be quite effective: The Rapid Fire Exploding Man 2d6 EB (10 points). NND (+1). Make sure the defense is something that your character has. Area effect 5" radius (+1). Autofire 10 shots (+1, +1 for a non-standard attack power). 0 END (+1, because of autofire). No Range (-1/2). 60 active points. 40 real points. If I recall correctly, No Range area effect attacks always hit. That means all 10 shots hit, for an average of 70 STUN pips to everyone within 5" of your character. Zoiks! Most villains will fall instantly if they have neither the NND defense nor Damage Reduction. If you want to get even more obscene, take a multipower and fill it with a few of these attacks, each slot having a different NND defense to guarantee that you'll be ready for any villain. Add a final slot with a BODY Drain for dealing with automatons that take no STUN. John "not in my campaign" Speroni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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