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Marvel Cinematic Universe, Phase Three and BEYOOOOONND


Bazza

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I actually like the fact that Hollywood has finally figured out that "superheroes" is a very wide meta-genre that can be used in a wide variety of films/styles, and not all superhero movies have to be the same. Superhero comedy? Awesome. Post-apoc superheroes? Great. Dark Conspiracy Supers? Ok. Horror Supers?...no interest in it personally, but seems like there'd be a market for it.

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It would be nice if Hollywood would get hip to the fact that one meta-genre they can also do is the Superhero Comic Book movie. Deadpool, the only recent example that comes immediately to mind, was regarded as an outrageous experiment that they feared would flop hard, until it scored huge because holy crap! audiences actually like the wacky costumes, the silly code-names, and the wild, unrealistic antics/storytelling after all!

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I'm not sure Deadpool is the best vehicle for conveying that lesson. A lot of those comic-book conventions were played for laughs. Not that there's anything inherently wrong with that, but we've only recently outgrown the conventional wisdom that superhero movies have to be campy to appeal to a wider public.

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I actually like the fact that Hollywood has finally figured out that "superheroes" is a very wide meta-genre that can be used in a wide variety of films/style

 

 

Right, that's why I'm no entirely dismayed by this take.  Its not what I think the New Mutants should be, and its not what I'd do with them, but its an interesting take.  I get the feel that this is something like Flatliners or Jacob's Ladder with people experiencing their own nightmares.

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I think that if you tone down the crass humor and blatant fourth wall-breaking in Deadpool you have the foundation for a highly entertaining comic book superhero movie. The lesson was still conveyed, though you have to be able to recognize it as such from the movie we actually got. Of course, I don't believe for a second that Hollywood, as a whole, is.

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Right, that's why I'm no entirely dismayed by this take.  Its not what I think the New Mutants should be, and its not what I'd do with them, but its an interesting take.  I get the feel that this is something like Flatliners or Jacob's Ladder with people experiencing their own nightmares.

 

If they're going for the Demon Bear storyline, I think it'd be OK, but as a second or even third installment. Let them establish the characters and the background for it first, instead of let that kind of storyline set the tone.

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Hm, we'll see I guess.  Hard to beleive explorers could be so wrong they missed El Dorado by an entire continent and thousands of miles though, that was a goofball reach.

 

I liked Wakanda better as a very simple, agrarian society with great resources more than a super-futuristic utopia wonderland.  But I like Black Panther better as a very skilled fighter who has techniques to make him better instead of... black Iron Man.  

 

I did like him in Civil War though.  Only part of the movie besides Spider-Man that I liked.

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While I understand drawing those parallels, the way the Black Panther fights on screen so far is very different from Iron Man's. The Panther's tech has been "upgraded" over decades in the comics. Likewise how Wakanda has been depicted has evolved. Now while I'm not saying anyone here is looking at it that way, someone reading "agrarian society with great resources" could accuse that of being a stereotypical Western perspective of Africa. One of the reasons the Black Panther mythology resonates so much with many black people, is because Wakanda is the most technologically advanced nation in the world, yet it was never conquered, never colonized by Europeans. Its contemporary society is firmly rooted in its traditional culture, not the wake of white masters. And T'Challa is not just a superhero, he's a king, of a country where that title means a lot. The Black Panther symbolizes the greatness of Africa's past, and its potential greatness in the future.

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My guess is that they want to give black kids a hero to look up to that's awesome as Iron Man is awesome, and that's fine.  I just think they kind of went a bit overboard with the sci fi wonder city.  I mean its hard to justify that existing in the middle of the hell hole that much of Africa is without doing anything about it.

 

One of the reasons the Black Panther mythology resonates so much with many black people, is because Wakanda is the most technologically advanced nation in the world, yet it was never conquered, never colonized by Europeans.

 

 

I think that's what they're shooting for but if you asked 1000 black people what Wakanda is, 999 would say "who?" not "Oh yes, that story fills me with pride and courage!"  Maybe it will once this film comes out but right now, he's just a very minor character in a comic book.

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Couldn't we have said the same thing about Themiscyra before Wonder Woman's movie? And now I hear from woman after woman that seeing all those strong, magnificent women in their own society fills them with pride and the sense of empowerment. For comic readers it wasn't news, but for the wider movie audience it hit like a revelation.

 

And from the comic-book history perspective, the Black Panther was never a minor character. He was the first black superhero in mainstream American comics, created at a time when that name carried a big political resonance. He's starred in his own comics series repeatedly over the years, as well as an animated television series. His stories have dealt with very mature and controversial issues.

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Couldn't we have said the same thing about Themiscyra before Wonder Woman's movie? And now I hear from woman after woman that seeing all those strong, magnificent women in their own society fills them with pride and the sense of empowerment. For comic readers it wasn't news, but for the wider movie audience it hit like a revelation.

 

Really? It seems to me the revelation is that Hollywood finally had the (financial and creative) courage to show a female society in that form on screen, not that female viewers are awakening to a feeling of empowerment they never previously imagined.

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