CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

[kahuna's bro]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Dude' date=' there's nothing stopping you from powering down and de-aging some of the villains in the books. In fact, if you buy the character pack for hero designer(and own hero designer), you can then modify them pretty easily to suit your tastes.[/quote']

also ther is nothing wrong is doing the same for heroes and useing them as models[iron man armored adventures for example]

[Nuclear Fridge]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

And that's the beauty of this setting - there really is no 'right' or 'wrong' way to use characters like GRAB, The Warlord, or Fiacho.

 

I'm going to use Brainchild & Cybermind as the 'leaders' of the Techno Faction, with Bulldozer as their right hand man to keep the Z-grade hired help (like Pulson) in line.

Only problem is, their nerd DNA is going to *@%%$ up their plans before they even get started... Like the mind-control device to make Cateran their 'hot babe sidekick'.

You can see where this is going...

[Lord Liaden]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

It's almost certainly too late to include this concept in this project, but for future reference this seems like as good a place as any to bring it up...

 

The current Champions Universe includes several masters of genetic manipulation -- Teleios, Dr. Moreau, King Cobra, the Overbrain -- but no one whose specialty is cybernetics, providing a handy origin for cyborg villains and heroes. The 4E CU had several, including Doc Digital and PsiBorg.

 

For my own recent CU-based campaign I dusted off an official Fourth Edition cyber-scientist who I'm pretty sure is still part of the Champions IP: Dr. Samuel Levy, mentioned in connection with Halfjack in Classic Enemies, and Cyborgs Inc. in the 4E VIPER sourcebook. IMHO anyone who keeps pet cyborg panthers has a leg-up on mad-scientist coolness.

 

[shameless self-promotion] For my purposes I had Dr. Levy originally working for VIPER, where he was responsible for the "upgrades" to Halfjack and Ripper; but he chafed under VIPER's restrictions to his research. ARGENT contacted him with a better offer, and helped him fake his own death to throw VIPER off his trail. ARGENT set up an independent laboratory for Dr. Levy, but kept him on retainer and referred clients to him. On behalf of ARGENT Dr. Levy created Interface, and Circuit Breaker who later joined the hero team Nova. [/shameless self-promotion]

[BobGreenwade]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Something to possibly mention in the Introductions of the books is the idea of using some of the "how to change this character" options for the individuals -- especially any that are given for changing the character's tone -- and applying them at a wholesale level to create reimagined parallel worlds with minimal work on the GM. For example, if several of the high-tech villains have options for making them mystical in nature (yes, realistically such a thing would be a couple of sentences in the Introduction with maybe a note or two on individuals, but play along with me here), such options could be applied across the board for an overwhelmingly mystical version of the Champions Universe. Similarly, something to convert the mystical individuals into technology users could be used to make a world where what's recognized as magic doesn't work. Characters could also be given a more "pulp" feel (or Victorian, a la "Gotham by Gaslight"), or a variety of other ideas.

 

Alternately, this suggestion could be kept in principle by just doing a half or (at most) full page on converting the characters by genre (as, I think, has already been suggested) and pointing out how this can be done to create alternate universes for dimension-hopping PCs.

[wcw43921]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Here's a couple of ideas I had--

 

*In this thread I asked the question "Why would a superpowed criminal work for someone other than himself?" The idea was that superpowers were like winning the lottery, and most people who win big lottery prizes usually decide not to work for anyone but themselves, so why would a supervillain? While I got some good responses from the other posters to the thread, I thought you might wish to put in a few words on the subject as well.

 

*Maybe you could answer, if anyone could, why Willaim Chow still calls himself Utility. As I've said before, to my mind that name is so blah, so meh, so nothing. For someone who prides himself on his superiority, he certainly displayed an inferior imagination the day he named his super-identity. I once suggested he could call himself Ultimate One, and wear a costume that suggested he might be some sort of android to throw people off suspicion of his true identity.

 

Apparently, though, I'm the only one who has a problem with the name. But if you, or someone, could explain the name to me, I would appreciate it.

 

Hope that helps.

[Nuclear Fridge]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Should all else fail & he gets beaten up regularly, he can fall back on rewiring his Omni-Pistol as the world's finest pocket tool kit?

[Lord Liaden]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

*Maybe you could answer' date=' if anyone could, why Willaim Chow still calls himself [b']Utility[/b]. As I've said before, to my mind that name is so blah, so meh, so nothing. For someone who prides himself on his superiority, he certainly displayed an inferior imagination the day he named his super-identity. I once suggested he could call himself Ultimate One, and wear a costume that suggested he might be some sort of android to throw people off suspicion of his true identity.

 

Apparently, though, I'm the only one who has a problem with the name. But if you, or someone, could explain the name to me, I would appreciate it.

 

Perhaps because that kind of pretentiousness is a hallmark of the superhumans he wants to show up. William Chow's description in CKC emphasizes that he doesn't strut or boast or threaten. He just calmly and efficiently gets the job done, whatever the circumstances, through intelligent planning and use of the right tools. To me "Utility" is a succinct description of his approach and his strengths.

 

Besides, "utility" has a pedigree in comics culture. It's not like Batman uses an "Omega-belt."

[BobGreenwade]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

This one's from the Department of Naughty Boys:

 

Include C.L.O.W.N. in the Index for the Groups book. Don't include the character sheets; just list them in the Index. (Or, if there's a common Master Index for all three books, list them there but say they're in Volume IV.)

 

It probably won't happen, but at least thinking about it should be worth a laugh.

[ChaplainAtheon]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I'd love to see some "grey area" villains. Ones that are spawned not from insanity, blind rage, or megalomania but of a true belief in something that may or may not be evil or bad. Say a Patriot hero who is disgusted with the lies he sees his government perpetrating or the severity of the violence he has witnessed and becomes someone who opposes the government. He doesn't indiscriminately kill or harm innocents (in fact he goes out of his way not to) but he does try to uncover the truth by any means necessary. If that means hurting (not killing) guards to get into a restricted area to gain some kind of proof of a covered up military action he'll do it just to expose the issue to daylight. He'll steal vehicles and work with known criminal elements to gain the access and tools he needs to uncover what he sees as wrong doing.

 

Something the players struggle with beyond the powers, PD and ED of the villain is where the true fight begins!

[lapsedgamer]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

How about some sort of alliance diagram to show how everyone cooperates, or does not, in the default CU. You could then run plot threads based off of this up the side or acrosss the bottom of the page. Hilarity could ensue.

 

Along the same line, maybe some organizational charts for the bigger agencies.

 

Guess who recently had to take a managment class at work.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

How about some sort of alliance diagram to show how everyone cooperates' date=' or does not, in the default CU.[/quote']I'll second this part. I'd go so far as to call it a brilliant idea.

[bigbywolfe]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I'd love to see some "grey area" villains. Ones that are spawned not from insanity, blind rage, or megalomania but of a true belief in something that may or may not be evil or bad. Say a Patriot hero who is disgusted with the lies he sees his government perpetrating or the severity of the violence he has witnessed and becomes someone who opposes the government. He doesn't indiscriminately kill or harm innocents (in fact he goes out of his way not to) but he does try to uncover the truth by any means necessary. If that means hurting (not killing) guards to get into a restricted area to gain some kind of proof of a covered up military action he'll do it just to expose the issue to daylight. He'll steal vehicles and work with known criminal elements to gain the access and tools he needs to uncover what he sees as wrong doing.

 

Something the players struggle with beyond the powers, PD and ED of the villain is where the true fight begins!

 

Considering that there are a number of characters like this in the 5E material I'm sure there will still be plenty in the new books.

[megaplayboy]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I'd like to see this trio of books be quite successful...and then see another trio of books in 2 years, this time featuring 300 brand new characters, including master villains, solos, and villain teams. Variety is the spice of campaign life, and also it really helps book sales.

[mattingly]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Advice on running Thugs. How do you differentiate Thug 1 from Thug 2? What are some personality traits, unusual maneuvers, strange weapon choices that can make them memorable? What kind of Thugs would go to work for Villian X, and why?

 

It's a common enough trope that to get to the main bad guy, you have to make your way through an increasing hierarchy of Thugs. I want ways to make that more fun for my players, and for me as GM.

[BobGreenwade]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I'd like to see this trio of books be quite successful...and then see another trio of books in 2 years' date=' this time featuring 300 [i']brand new[/i] characters, including master villains, solos, and villain teams. Variety is the spice of campaign life, and also it really helps book sales.

This is highly unlikely, of course; DOJ no longer owns the CU, remember. (Not that I'd object to such a thing.)

[megaplayboy]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

This is highly unlikely' date=' of course; DOJ no longer owns the CU, remember. (Not that I'd object to such a thing.)[/quote']

 

 

From what I've heard regarding the level of commercial success of CO, I'm not entirely sure this will be a problem by 2012 or 2013.

[Lord Liaden]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I don't think there's anything stopping DoJ from putting out a volume of "generic" villains that aren't part of official Champions Universe continuity and have no connection to the CU. Come to think of it, Steve Long has even mentioned that in the worst case scenario -- something making the Champions license unusable by Hero Games -- they could always create their own all-new setting. So I should think an unintegrated villain volume would be easily doable. Considering how many Hero gamers simply crib elements from published books for their own games, that would probably sell as well as any other villain book.

[bobooton]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Something that might be helpful would be a listing by DC. So if I was looking for a villain or a group of villains of a similar power level, I could find it just by running my finger down an index.

[Greywind]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I don't think there's anything stopping DoJ from putting out a volume of "generic" villains that aren't part of official Champions Universe continuity and have no connection to the CU. Come to think of it' date=' Steve Long has even mentioned that in the worst case scenario -- something making the Champions license unusable by Hero Games -- they could always create their own all-new setting. So I should think an unintegrated villain volume would be easily doable. Considering how many Hero gamers simply crib elements from published books for their own games, that would probably sell as well as any other villain book.[/quote']Failing that, the general membership here can do as we've always done and post up characters we've made.

[Derek Hiemforth]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

2. I don't particularly care for the "how to use this guy as a hero" bit; it's more work for me that I don't think most gamers will ever get any use out of. But as usual, never say never.

Upon reflection, I agree that it would be of questionable value in many cases (probably including the Foxbat example I initially used; I think most gamers could easily see how Freddy could have come out a good guy or a true bad guy). So probably best not to be something included for every character. But it might be an interesting tidbit to include for characters that it would be particularly appropriate for. Like perhaps a note in the Campaign Use section that "If only Kinetik hadn't made the unfortunate choice to call Richard "Dick" before learning that his surname was "Head," perhaps Galactomind would now be The Champions greatest ally instead of their most tenacious foe..."

 

On a more serious note, things like this might be particularly appropriate to include for Master Villains. Whether for good or ill, almost any campaign where time travel is possible will probably feature a story sooner or later that involves something like, "Let's go back in time and prevent Albert Zerstoiten from ever becoming Doctor Destroyer!" Potential "sliding doors" moments like these could easily inspire such adventures...

[Lord Liaden]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

On a more serious note' date=' things like this might be particularly appropriate to include for Master Villains. Whether for good or ill, almost any campaign where time travel is possible will probably feature a story sooner or later that involves something like, "Let's go back in time and prevent Albert Zerstoiten from ever becoming Doctor Destroyer!" Potential "sliding doors" moments like these could easily inspire such adventures... [/quote']

 

Hmm... IMHO, in most cases a GM willing and able to develop such a timeline-changing scenario, probably has his or her own ideas on how to change a villain's past.

 

Dr. D would be a particularly bad candidate for this concept, too. I read Book Of The Destroyer, and Albert Zerstoiten was a world-class megalomaniacal jerk almost from birth.

[JmOz]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

Yeah' date=' according to her write-up in [i']Conquerors, Killers, And Crooks[/i] that's an exaggeration -- it's only around a hundred million.

 

Given her concept, one would be well justified to take any published character, weapon, or vehicle, change its name and perhaps appearance, and call it part of V'han's forces.

 

Note that the current 2011 publishing schedule includes the Book Of The Empress, giving Istvatha the same detailed treatment as Dr. Destroyer and Mechanon have already received in their own "Books Of...".

 

 

Perfect for some tit for tat, using the players characters against them

[GestaltBennie]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

I don't think there's anything stopping DoJ from putting out a volume of "generic" villains that aren't part of official Champions Universe continuity and have no connection to the CU. Come to think of it' date=' Steve Long has even mentioned that in the worst case scenario -- something making the Champions license unusable by Hero Games -- they could always create their own all-new setting. So I should think an unintegrated villain volume would be easily doable. Considering how many Hero gamers simply crib elements from published books for their own games, that would probably sell as well as any other villain book.[/quote']

 

There's also npthing stopping a third party publisher from doing this, if they operate under the appropriate license.

[Logan D. Hurricanes]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

There's also npthing stopping a third party publisher from doing this' date=' if they operate under the appropriate license. [/quote']

Preposterous!

 

You might as well try to put a man on the moon!

[Sketchpad]

Re: CHAMPIONS VILLAINS -- What Do *You* Want To See?

 

There's also npthing stopping a third party publisher from doing this' date=' if they operate under the appropriate license. [/quote']

 

Something you're planning, Scott?