[Police brutality] American injustice, yet again.

[TrickstaPriest]

I really appreciate you too, Old Man, for having the patience I do not.

[Matt the Bruins]

1 hour ago, grandmastergm said:

STOP TREATING COPS LIKE ANIMALS AND THUGS AND TREAT THEM WITH RESPECT. 

Maybe they should try not ACTING like animals and thugs, and EARNING respect through their behavior? When that approach is taken, it seems to work, as in Camden NJ. Dressing up like commandos and playing live action Call of Duty in the streets, not so much.

 

1 hour ago, grandmastergm said:

These cops would sacrifice their lives to protect us from criminals and terrorists- and yet all I see is an appalling sense of contempt, moronic cynicism, anti-american communist and anarchist sentiments, and flat-out sedition.

The police being protested only protect their own, unless you're talking about the sort of "protection" that involves shaking businesses down for bribes so they don't get raided or burned down. I'll take my chances with the criminals and terrorists, thanks. At least if *they* murder me, there's a chance of them facing justice for it.

 

Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of good, ethical police in this country. Two are friends of mine, and have spoken out against the officers who disgraced their oaths and badges with the actions that sparked this round of protests. But on an institutional level police departments and unions punish that sort of officer if they try to do anything about the abuses of authority they see; and protect the ones committing the abuses. That needs to change, soon.

[ScottishFox]

17 hours ago, Pariah said:

I'll be honest, until a few weeks ago I didn't know a no-knock warrant was even a thing. I'm shocked an perplexed that such a procedure even exists.

 

To me, the phrase "No-knock warrant" fairly screams of "unreasonable search and seizure".

 

I had the same reaction and my thought was that every cop that dies during one of these things deserves it and every civilian who kills a cop during what seems to be a home invasion deserves a medal of valor.

 

How can a no-knock warrant be executed by plains clothes cops be perceived as anything else by civilians?  This is straight up evil by police.

 

Surround the structure, knock and announce yourselves as police, bring a warrant and act like actual law enforcement.

[TrickstaPriest]

Sorry for the attitudes from them!  But, because it's being discussed...

 

  

 

 

 

[Old Man]

FWIW the protests are working, if slowly.  The Minneapolis PD is done.  Choke holds are now banned in many cities or states.  Tear gas and rubber bullets were banned in Seattle, at least on paper.  Confederate statues and flags are finally coming down.

[TrickstaPriest]

3 minutes ago, Old Man said:

FWIW the protests are working, if slowly.  The Minneapolis PD is done.  Choke holds are now banned in many cities or states.  Tear gas and rubber bullets were banned in Seattle, at least on paper.  Confederate statues and flags are finally coming down.

 

The last I don't think is going to have much of an impact until the people who still use that symbol to threaten others change.  But it might be a comfort to some.  Right now we still have people using nooses in their protests and other fun and delightful things online, so let's see how that goes.

 

The rest is a great change.  I hope we can get this to stick... but I have no idea what else to push for.

 

I also wish we could get our country off oil.  In theory that's easier... you just have to fight Big Money.

[Ragitsu]

38 minutes ago, TrickstaPriest said:

you just have to fight Big Money.

 

That's like saying "You just have to wrestle Heracles to the ground."

[Duke Bushido]

3 hours ago, Matt the Bruins said:

Maybe they should try not ACTING like animals and thugs, and EARNING respect through their behavior? When that approach is taken, it seems to work, as in Camden NJ. Dressing up like commandos and playing live action Call of Duty in the streets, not so much.

 

 

 

 

To put it into perspective:

 

https://i.imgur.com/LtHOwAV.mp4

[TrickstaPriest]

11 minutes ago, Ragitsu said:

 

That's like saying "You just have to wrestle Heracles to the ground."

 

...yep.

 

Changing the attitudes and the way policing is done is going to be hard.  😕  I'm glad we got this start.  We'll need it.

[csyphrett]

7 hours ago, grandmastergm said:

To be perfectly honest from you, I come from a family of cops.  I recall growing up as a child with the fear that harm could happen to my parents.  When I see the sedition, subversion, rioting, and other criminal acts being excused by the cult of BLM, its media apologists, politicians, and members; my blood boils.  

 

STOP TREATING COPS LIKE ANIMALS AND THUGS AND TREAT THEM WITH RESPECT.  And I'm glad that Fox News is the ONLY network providing any kind of sympathy to police and their families like mine.  I'm proud to come from a cop family, I'm proud to be white, I'm proud to be American; and I'm going to proud until I die.

 

I'm sick of seeing this parasitic behavior from the gaming community.  These cops would sacrifice their lives to protect us from criminals and terrorists- and yet all I see is an appalling sense of contempt, moronic cynicism, anti-american communist and anarchist sentiments, and flat-out sedition.

That's cool and all but Chicago PD broke into an office and turned it into their personal bar while there was rioting going on. I have dealt with the Sheriff's Department most of the time I have been working here, and I know they wouldn't do that. I showed a LT a newspaper story where the local police raided the wrong house and arrested a guy for dropping a mushroom on the floor. He asked me how long was the original target gone from the address. I was like a month. He shook his head. They had to shoot a guy two months ago. Never once did I doubt that the SO did the wrong thing.

 

I see a guy standing on someone's neck because he wanted to and I know that guy was a piece of crap.  It doesn't matter to me what anybody else says about their relatives, fellow police, the president. All that matters is at no point should anybody be standing on a guy's neck, and any defense is either stupid, or evil.

CES       

[Badger]

I didn't like the way the statues were removed, though. From purely historical viewpoint. Needed to be locked away in a museum to  be shown as an example of our mistakes.  The people of 1000 years will be all the dumber for our actions this week.

 

The more info the more truth you learn from history. I feel more like I am watching a modern version of a book burning.  Remove from public view, 100 percent.  To destroy is unforgivable. 

 

History is a subject I have passion for, like I find many of you here have for science. This has not been a good week in that sense.

 

 

[Badger]

And sorry about being a little down on it all.  I find instead of confronting our past scars which must be done to ever move past it. We are really just trying to bury it to avoid that moment.

 

There have been high points with this, so don't get me wrong on that. But, I have doubts anyone is ready to confront the bigger picture.

 

 

[Ragitsu]

13 minutes ago, Badger said:

I didn't like the way the statues were removed, though. From purely historical viewpoint. Needed to be locked away in a museum to  be shown as an example of our mistakes.  The people of 1000 years will be all the dumber for our actions this week.

 

The more info the more truth you learn from history. I feel more like I am watching a modern version of a book burning.  Remove from public view, 100 percent.  To destroy is unforgivable. 

 

History is a subject I have passion for, like I find many of you here have for science. This has not been a good week in that sense.

 

 

 

...were any of them demolished? Last I heard, some of those statues were relocated to a Confederate cemetery.

[TrickstaPriest]

18 minutes ago, Badger said:

And sorry about being a little down on it all.  I find instead of confronting our past scars which must be done to ever move past it. We are really just trying to bury it to avoid that moment.

 

At least some of those statues are mass produced.  IIRC, there are literally hundreds of copies of them scattered throughout the states.  those statues I think can safely be destroyed/demolished.  Even without these, there are plenty of things to remember our past here.

 

It's okay to be down on it.  There are lots of little things that bother me.  The big thing that bothers me is more just making sure that this successfully tackles the issues it's facing.

[Pattern Ghost]

45 minutes ago, Badger said:

To destroy is unforgivable. 

 

Putting them up during the Jim Crow era was unforgivable. They were a tool of intimidation from the start, not history lessons. We have these things called "books" for learning history from. The statues aren't needed.

 

Here's an article on the statues.

 

https://www.history.com/news/how-the-u-s-got-so-many-confederate-monuments

[TrickstaPriest]

18 minutes ago, Pattern Ghost said:

https://www.history.com/news/how-the-u-s-got-so-many-confederate-monuments

 

That's what I was trying to describe / remember about, why they were mass produced (and some information on their mass production to begin with).  Thanks for supplying the resource.

[pinecone]

2 hours ago, Badger said:

And sorry about being a little down on it all.  I find instead of confronting our past scars which must be done to ever move past it. We are really just trying to bury it to avoid that moment.

 

There have been high points with this, so don't get me wrong on that. But, I have doubts anyone is ready to confront the bigger picture.

 

 

Well, they can put the broken confederate statues next to the broken Sadam H statues, etc...that shows the history does it not?

[Doc Democracy]

2 hours ago, Badger said:

I didn't like the way the statues were removed, though. From purely historical viewpoint. Needed to be locked away in a museum to  be shown as an example of our mistakes.  The people of 1000 years will be all the dumber for our actions this week.

I am not convinced that removing the statues will do that much damage, to quote a tweet I saw this week

 

“After WWII Germany took down and removed all of the statues and monuments associated with the Nazi regime.  That is why, today, no one knows who Hitler was.”

 

I think we have plenty of things that tell us what we need to know and I struggle to understand what part of history those statues will enlighten us about.

 

People are problematic, it is rare to have someone you can immortalise in marble that people will not have issues with, because humans are flawed creatures.  I prefer my public works of art to be more abstract and anonymous.

 

Doc

[Greywind]

One  thing with Hitler and the Nazis is that people refuse to believe the Holocaust happened.

[pinecone]

11 hours ago, grandmastergm said:

To be perfectly honest from you, I come from a family of cops.  I recall growing up as a child with the fear that harm could happen to my parents.  When I see the sedition, subversion, rioting, and other criminal acts being excused by the cult of BLM, its media apologists, politicians, and members; my blood boils.  

 

STOP TREATING COPS LIKE ANIMALS AND THUGS AND TREAT THEM WITH RESPECT.  And I'm glad that Fox News is the ONLY network providing any kind of sympathy to police and their families like mine.  I'm proud to come from a cop family, I'm proud to be white, I'm proud to be American; and I'm going to proud until I die.

 

I'm sick of seeing this parasitic behavior from the gaming community.  These cops would sacrifice their lives to protect us from criminals and terrorists- and yet all I see is an appalling sense of contempt, moronic cynicism, anti-american communist and anarchist sentiments, and flat-out sedition.

respect is earned. People who act like animals Should be viewed as a danger to society. The police have No requirement to protect anyone but themselves. And a short time looking at you tube can show you cowardance, unjustified violence and more. That includes blatant contempt for the constitution. That is "sedition" if anything is. If you know, or knew a "good" cop, how is he, or she still a cop? Surely they spoke up, and prevented bad cops from acting? No? Then they lack integrity and honor, and that means they are bad cops. Even if they only sin by omission.

[Lord Liaden]

33 minutes ago, Greywind said:

One  thing with Hitler and the Nazis is that people refuse to believe the Holocaust happened.

 

Which, of course, has nothing to do with the presence or absence of his statues. If Holocaust denial was correctable by proof and education alone, it wouldn't exist. Its motivations are more complex and emotional than simple ignorance.

 

 

[Pattern Ghost]

35 minutes ago, pinecone said:

If you know, or knew a "good" cop, how is he, or she still a cop? Surely they spoke up, and prevented bad cops from acting? No? Then they lack integrity and honor, and that means they are bad cops. Even if they only sin by omission.

 

Or it could mean that they work with other good cops. Not every police force is corrupt, abusive, or incompetent.

[Starlord]

14 hours ago, grandmastergm said:

To be perfectly honest from you, I come from a family of cops.  I recall growing up as a child with the fear that harm could happen to my parents.  When I see the sedition, subversion, rioting, and other criminal acts being excused by the cult of BLM, its media apologists, politicians, and members; my blood boils.  

 

STOP TREATING COPS LIKE ANIMALS AND THUGS AND TREAT THEM WITH RESPECT.  And I'm glad that Fox News is the ONLY network providing any kind of sympathy to police and their families like mine.  I'm proud to come from a cop family, I'm proud to be white, I'm proud to be American; and I'm going to proud until I die.

 

I'm sick of seeing this parasitic behavior from the gaming community.  These cops would sacrifice their lives to protect us from criminals and terrorists- and yet all I see is an appalling sense of contempt, moronic cynicism, anti-american communist and anarchist sentiments, and flat-out sedition.

 

I'm proud of being tall.  Also, my hazel eyes...and my smooth, baby-soft skin.

[pinecone]

5 minutes ago, Pattern Ghost said:

 

Or it could mean that they work with other good cops. Not every police force is corrupt, abusive, or incompetent.

I could buy that Only if it is a small burg someplace. And yet those places have quite the bad rep.....? At this point I would need proof. The image of armed and armored thugs shoving a 75 year old man down, then walking past as his blood formed a pool is burned into my memory. Where was the "good" cop? Sorry, I have a huge reserve of rage right now, so I may be ranting some.

[Pattern Ghost]

1 hour ago, pinecone said:

Sorry, I have a huge reserve of rage right now, so I may be ranting some.

 

It can be good to vent a little, sometimes. I was just pointing out that you were getting a little personal there with a fellow Herophile. We may not always see eye to eye on the boards, but we tend to be a good gang all around, so I'm more inclined to give people the benefit of the doubt.

 

I'm former military LE. When folks start swinging too broad a brush around about the military or about the police, I'm likely to get splattered, even though my active service days are long gone.