Marvel Cinematic Universe, Phase Three and BEYOOOOONND

[Bazza]

 

[megaplayboy]

20 minutes ago, Bazza said:

 

To be scrupulously fair, there were dozens of major actors in that film.  I'm not sure which of them would be put forward or could be without rubbing some of them the wrong way.  I could see RDJ and/or Chris Evans in the acting category, but I think a lot of the rest either weren't in the film long enough or the acting wasn't particularly outstanding by "serious film" standards.  

[Old Man]

To be fair, it was the biggest ensemble cast in recent memory.  No one had enough screen time, but RDJ, Evans, and Gillan ought to get some sort of recognition.

[Hugh Neilson]

5 hours ago, zslane said:

Until the Suicide Squad movie came out, Harley Quinn's signature motif was a red and black. It wasn't until the movie's "success" that this shifted to red and blue. There is nothing in the movie version that resembles the comic book version that came before it; if anything the comics have since decided to adapt to the movie version of the character.

 

Quote

“Every clip that I’ve seen of Margot as Harley, she seems to have nailed it perfectly. When she’s introducing herself to Katana, when she’s walking around with the bat behind her shoulders, she just seems to have really channeled the true spirit of the character," he said. "Seeing that come alive is just amazing for me. I saw the shot yesterday of her and Joker in the therapy session getting ready to kiss, and I was just like, ‘That’s it, that’s my girl.’”

 

From his comments, I suggest Dini was more concerned with capturing the character than the costume.

 

MCU takes some liberties with the costumes as well.  A Hulk without purple pants?  Thor's hair isn't long enough.  Tony Stark never wore facial hair beyond a moustache.  That's not Hawkeye's costume.

[zslane]

I'd say that when it comes to properly stroking Hollywood egos in interviews, Dini is a quick learner. You play the Hollywood spin game, or you don't get to play in Hollywood at all.

[Christopher R Taylor]

She seemed a bit more hard edged and violent than his Harley but she did have glimpses of the animated one.

[Greywind]

5 hours ago, Hugh Neilson said:

From his comments, I suggest Dini was more concerned with capturing the character than the costume.

 

MCU takes some liberties with the costumes as well.  A Hulk without purple pants?  Thor's hair isn't long enough.  Tony Stark never wore facial hair beyond a moustache.  That's not Hawkeye's costume.

 

Marvel also drew fairly heavily on the Ultimate versions. Hawkeye's outfit was more in line with that. Just needed the shades.

[Lord Liaden]

19 hours ago, Old Man said:

To be fair, it was the biggest ensemble cast in recent memory.  No one had enough screen time, but RDJ, Evans, and Gillan ought to get some sort of recognition.

 

IMHO there should be a "Best Actor in a Comedy" category so Chris Hemsworth could be nominated.

[Bazza]

I’d suggest that for many people, Black Panther did just that: convey emotional & psychological experiences of an African & African American who is portrayed as a king, a hero, and a good honourable person. How may people can relate to a mafia hitman? Mmm, not that many. 

 

 

Looking at the films he has directed, there is only 2, maybe 3, I’d see. 

[Bazza]

For those watching. I’d be surprised if there is a fourth season. Mainly because of the D+ shows. But then, the show can be seen as independent of the MCU, it really is just a backdrop for the show. 

[Bazza]

For those with some loose change. 

[Lord Liaden]

42 minutes ago, Bazza said:

I’d suggest that for many people, Black Panther did just that: convey emotional & psychological experiences of an African & African American who is portrayed as a king, a hero, and a good honourable person. How may people can relate to a mafia hitman? Mmm, not that many. 

 

 

Looking at the films he has directed, there is only 2, maybe 3, I’d see. 

 

I would suggest that Endgame spent a great deal of time exploring and communicating how all kinds of people deal with loss and grief, failure and guilt, our responsibility to each other, and to doing what's right even if that costs us everything. If Scorsese doesn't see that it's because he's unwilling to look.

 

But to cut him some slack, he is of a generation for most of whom superheroes were considered entertainment for children. Many of them can't see past that.

[Old Man]

Scorsese is a great filmmaker, but I’m not sure any of his films made me outright cry in the theater like Endgame did. 

[Christopher R Taylor]

He's right, but there's room for fun and spectacle in films, too.  Star Wars was a fun movie even if it wasn't Goodfellas.

[Starlord]

He is not right.

 

The comment is so ignorant and moronic it doesn't deserve a response.  I doubt he's watched any comic book movie in it's entirety.

[megaplayboy]

8 hours ago, Bazza said:

I’d suggest that for many people, Black Panther did just that: convey emotional & psychological experiences of an African & African American who is portrayed as a king, a hero, and a good honourable person. How may people can relate to a mafia hitman? Mmm, not that many. 

 

 

Looking at the films he has directed, there is only 2, maybe 3, I’d see. 

He's a brilliant filmmaker.  I think he's a bit off about this, but there is a kind of resentment of the MCU in parts of the film community.  I'd point out that most Westerns aren't especially psychologically deep, but that 4 westerns have won Best Picture, with another 19 nominated for Best Picture.  But Scorsese certainly wouldn't say that the Western isn't a cinematic genre.  Fantasy and Science Fiction films have also not been particularly well-rewarded during awards season.  There's a definite bias towards Dramatic films.  

But when the entire medium of film started, it was looked down upon by the live theater industry and by literary critics as having little to no artistic merit.  

I expect that at least one superhero film will sweep the Oscars in the next 20-30 years, and would bet there's a good chance it will be a Marvel Studios release.  

[Bazza]

II was wondering about westerns. Anyone know off the top of their heads which westerns won Best Picture? 

 

Also agree with MP on a number of points. 

[dmjalund]

1 hour ago, Bazza said:

II was wondering about westerns. Anyone know off the top of their heads which westerns won Best Picture? 

Unforgiven 

[Old Man]

Unforgiven, Cimarron, Dances with Wolves, and (if you can call it a Western) No Country for Old Men.

[Christopher R Taylor]

He didn't say superhero movies aren't a part of the cinematic genre.  He just said they're thrill rides and fluff, which they are.  Nothing wrong with being that kind of movie, just don't pretend they're deeper and more meaningful than they are.  Indiana Jones films are loads of fun and good movies, but that doesn't make them great cinema.  Its good for people to be able to recognize objective quality differences.  I like reading Louis L'Amour but that doesn't mean I think his writing is the same quality as Patrick O'Brian or any of the other giants of literature.  I enjoy pop songs from the 60s but I know they aren't Bach. 

 

I mean, we just got done recently talking about how the overall quality level of movies from Hollywood has plummeted and you just don't see great films as often as you did in times past.  How's that different than what he's saying here?  Just because we like something or find it emotionally compelling does not mean its necessarily of the greatest quality.  It just reached us in a place that moved us.  I think its healthy and part of maturity and education to be able to understand that distinction.

[Pattern Ghost]

47 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

I enjoy pop songs from the 60s but I know they aren't Bach. 

 

 

[csyphrett]

55 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

He didn't say superhero movies aren't a part of the cinematic genre.  He just said they're thrill rides and fluff, which they are.  Nothing wrong with being that kind of movie, just don't pretend they're deeper and more meaningful than they are.  Indiana Jones films are loads of fun and good movies, but that doesn't make them great cinema.  Its good for people to be able to recognize objective quality differences.  I like reading Louis L'Amour but that doesn't mean I think his writing is the same quality as Patrick O'Brian or any of the other giants of literature.  I enjoy pop songs from the 60s but I know they aren't Bach. 

 

I mean, we just got done recently talking about how the overall quality level of movies from Hollywood has plummeted and you just don't see great films as often as you did in times past.  How's that different than what he's saying here?  Just because we like something or find it emotionally compelling does not mean its necessarily of the greatest quality.  It just reached us in a place that moved us.  I think its healthy and part of maturity and education to be able to understand that distinction.

Who's Patrick O'Brien?

CES

[zslane]

I also think it depends on the audience in question. There is a sizable audience for whom Boyz n the Hood is as deeply cinematic, dramatic, and meaningful as Raging Bull is to any Scorsese fan. Martin Scorsese is certainly free to hold up his movies (and by implication the American New Wave in general) as exemplars of cinema, but he can't expect everyone to agree with him.

[Lord Liaden]

3 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

He didn't say superhero movies aren't a part of the cinematic genre.  He just said they're thrill rides and fluff, which they are.  Nothing wrong with being that kind of movie, just don't pretend they're deeper and more meaningful than they are. 

 

He also said, "It isn't the cinema of human beings trying to convey emotional, psychological experiences to another human being." On that front I believe he's wrong, and hasn't been paying attention.

[Scott Ruggels]

21 hours ago, Bazza said:

I’d suggest that for many people, Black Panther did just that: convey emotional & psychological experiences of an African & African American who is portrayed as a king, a hero, and a good honourable person. How may people can relate to a mafia hitman? Mmm, not that many. 

 

 

Looking at the films he has directed, there is only 2, maybe 3, I’d see. 

Scorsese I think has a point in his comparison, as he is a skilled film maker, and he has done more than just Mafia films. (The Aviator is a favorite). But he is bringing up the high art versus Low art dichotomy, and is assigning the MCU to the Low Art category. Not entirely fair, but not entirely unwarranted, either.  "Cinema" in that perspective, means stories the observe and comment on the contemporary human condition. "Movies" are escapist. Nothing wrong with either, but I am not much of a consumer of angst and depression.