Political Discussion Thread (With Rules)

[TrickstaPriest]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election/trump-2020-election-results-nevada-mail-in-ballots-fox-news-biden-latest-a9655176.html

 

So I mean... when does this stuff stop?

[Pariah]

There are two old sayings that come to mind here:

 

"If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the facts are against you, argue the law. If the law and the facts are against you, yell like Hell."

 

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullish*t."

 

Some combination of these two statements seems to be the President's entire strategy at this point.

 

He is, of course, aided by the fact that a large number of Americans are willing to put up with it simply because he has an (R) after his name.

[Old Man]

49 minutes ago, TrickstaPriest said:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election/trump-2020-election-results-nevada-mail-in-ballots-fox-news-biden-latest-a9655176.html

 

So I mean... when does this stuff stop?

 

Keep in mid that the primary objective is to ruin Americans' faith in the election process.  Once this is done, Americans will view election fraud as normal or even necessary. 

 

And note that the recent obvious attempts at voter suppression, such as the demolition of the USPS, is already accomplishing this primary objective.  That's part of the reason Trump is being so open about his attempts at sabotage.

 

Don't be afraid that Trump might steal the election.  Be afraid that democracy is about to end, forever.

 

 

[TrickstaPriest]

https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/503937-celebrities-and-politicians-speak-out-over-90-cut-in-polling

 

This is about the worst case of it - but a number of states (including mine) have closed down voting locations over the past few years.  Without mail in ballots, how are we supposed to vote?

[Pariah]

Oh, here we go.....

 

CNN Poll: Biden and Trump matchup tightens as enthusiasm hits new high

 

There's no room here for complacency. Biden supporters and Trump opponents need to keep the pedal to the metal until this thing is done. 

 

As a nation, and as a civilization, we cannot afford a repeat of 2016.

[wcw43921]

I Disagree With Biden A Lot, But--

[archer]

15 hours ago, Old Man said:

USPS announces sharp price increase on package delivery

 

Considering the US Post Office has lost more than $1.2 billion in each of the last two months, a large price increase of some kind was somewhat inevitable...even if the president and his cronies weren't screwing around with the Post Office due to the election.  

 

Frankly, I'd rather have increased prices on package delivery and bulk mail than on first class mail (just a personal preference).

 

And I think it's inevitable that mail delivery will be scaled back to 5 days a week rather than 6 days a week sometime within the next couple of years, regardless of who becomes president. That change has  been making more and more sense for the last couple of decades. The time to bite the bullet and actually do it is not very long after the November election. 

[Tom Cowan]

1 hour ago, archer said:

 

Considering the US Post Office has lost more than $1.2 billion in each of the last two months, a large price increase of some kind was somewhat inevitable...even if the president and his cronies weren't screwing around with the Post Office due to the election.  

 

Frankly, I'd rather have increased prices on package delivery and bulk mail than on first class mail (just a personal preference).

 

And I think it's inevitable that mail delivery will be scaled back to 5 days a week rather than 6 days a week sometime within the next couple of years, regardless of who becomes president. That change has  been making more and more sense for the last couple of decades. The time to bite the bullet and actually do it is not very long after the November election. 

5 days a week mail delivery, that would work

Post Offices, mail sorting and mail transport between centers should not stop on Friday at 5pm and how some people mess things up...

[ScottishFox]

21 hours ago, Pariah said:

He is, of course, aided by the fact that a large number of Americans are willing to put up with it simply because he has an (R) after his name.

 

In no world is Hillary Clinton a worse candidate than Joe Biden.  And Trump has already won once.

 

Incumbent presidents almost always win and while a creative new twist - I don't think the basement strategy is going to do the trick.

[Old Man]

7 hours ago, Tom Cowan said:

5 days a week mail delivery, that would work

Post Offices, mail sorting and mail transport between centers should not stop on Friday at 5pm and how some people mess things up...

As if the Postal Service were a business and not a service. Then again, if it were a business, perhaps it could have received some of the literal trillions of dollars in covid bailout money funneled into the private sector this summer. $1.2 billion a month is a rounding error, especially for the service that’s carrying mail in ballots this year. Oh wait, Congress did approve a $10B loan for the USPS in the CARES Act! I wonder who could be holding it up? 
 

And the only reason the USPS is in the red in the first place is the GOP’s PAEA Act in 2006 which requires that it prefund all retirement benefits, which literally no other organization in the universe is required to do. 

[archer]

1 hour ago, Old Man said:

 

And the only reason the USPS is in the red in the first place is the GOP’s PAEA Act in 2006 which requires that it prefund all retirement benefits, which literally no other organization in the universe is required to do. 

 

That turns out to not be the unvarnished truth.

 

This link covers through 2011 and states that PAEA expenses were estimated to be $5.6 billion per year for the first 10 years (page 3). Even without PAEA, the Postal Service started being in the red in 2009 and continued in the red through 2011 due to declining revenues (Figure 4).

 

https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R41024.pdf

 

====

 

At this link, the 2014 stats shows a net loss of $5.5 billion. So if you exclude those estimated PAEA expenses and take into account several postage rate increases in the intervening years, the USPS would have shown a profit. (page 41)

 

https://about.usps.com/publications/annual-report-comprehensive-statement-2014/annual-report-comprehensive-statement-v2-2014.pdf

 

====

 

At this link, the 2018 stats shows a loss of $3.9 billion (and a 2017 loss of $2.7 billion) 

 

https://about.usps.com/news/national-releases/2018/pr18_093.htm

 

Of particular interest, that USPS annual report states

 

Quote

Similar to the last several years, the Postal Service was unable to make the $6.9 billion in payments that were due to the federal government at the end of fiscal year 2018 to pre-fund pension and health benefits for postal retirees...Making the pre-funding payments in full or in part would have left the Postal Service with insufficient liquidity to ensure the continued achievement of our mission 

 

So in recent years, the Postal Service has been running huge losses plus hasn't even been paying the PAEA at all.

 

It's difficult to argue that the reason the Post Office is in the red is because of PAEA expenses which the Post Office itself admits it hasn't been paying. They aren't paying PAEA out of revenues. They aren't paying PAEA out of borrow funds. They have no PAEA pre-funding expenses because they aren't paying PAEA, regardless of what the legislation is supposed to obligate them to pre-fund.

 

We can argue about the best ways to fix the Post Office. But lets not start off on a false basis. If we completely repealed PAEA, it wouldn't make a difference to the fact that the Post Office was running deeply in the red even before COVID.

 

(As a point for discussion, nationwide sIngle-payer healthcare would likely huge strides toward solving the Post Office overall funding problems by drastically reducing their expenses but I haven't gone through their expense reports to see exactly what kind of impact that'd have.)

[Old Man]

Again, the point is that the profitability of the Post Office is irrelevant. It’s a service, not a business. No one worries about the profitability of the FDA or the Coast Guard. And again, the $10B loan that Congress already approved would go a long way toward avoiding any crisis this year, were it not being unconstitutionally delayed. 

[Pariah]

... and the FDA and the Coast Guard are not specifically identified as essential services in the Constitution.

[megaplayboy]

Well, it feels like MIchelle Obama just handed people their marching orders.  Hell of a speech.  

[Badger]

I am staying clear of the conventions. They end up as basically pep rallies. 

 

And I hated those things in high school, and being forced to attend them.

[megaplayboy]

5 hours ago, Badger said:

I am staying clear of the conventions. They end up as basically pep rallies. 

 

And I hated those things in high school, and being forced to attend them.

Different this year, a bit.  Being virtual means they have to have a condensed,  cohesive message every night.  Crammed into two hours.  It's like a cross between a very slick infomercial and a sincere pledge drive by your local PBS station.   Better than it sounds.   No endless chatter by news anchors during down time.

[Pariah]

5 hours ago, megaplayboy said:

No endless chatter by news anchors during down time.

 

This alone sounds like an improvement to me. 

[Ternaugh]

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/postmaster-general-dejoy-suspends-changes-usps-until-after-election-n1237122

[csyphrett]

21 minutes ago, Ternaugh said:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/postmaster-general-dejoy-suspends-changes-usps-until-after-election-n1237122

I wonder if that is because the local papers are posting where he lives and plastering pictures of his house on the front page with people flooding the edge of his property and the golf club next door.

 

If he lived in Bermuda Run, he could enjoy the golf course and have an old man to tell visitors they aren't on the list and they have to climb the fence

CES

[Pariah]

St. Louis Couple Who Brandished Guns At Black Protesters To Speak At RNC

 

[TrickstaPriest]

So Trump deserves a third term because he has accused the previous administration of spying on him for political reasons (as opposed to reasons of Nat'l Security).  And they dared impeach him.

 

Right.

 

edit;  I'm just literally so frustrated that he can say whatever he wants and an incredible large quantity of people have no problems with it.

[Old Man]

The Senate Intelligence Committee has released their report detailing Russian coordination with the Trump campaign to interfere in the 2016 election.  Basically, Trump's entire senior campaign staff was actively colluding with Russian intelligence, and there is no chance Trump didn't know about it.

[TrickstaPriest]

14 minutes ago, Old Man said:

The Senate Intelligence Committee has released their report detailing Russian coordination with the Trump campaign to interfere in the 2016 election.  Basically, Trump's entire senior campaign staff was actively colluding with Russian intelligence, and there is no chance Trump didn't know about it.

 

Would be nice to collate a list of things we can confirm and demonstrate.  Include everything he (Trump) has directly said about it too, and directly did (and why that's not okay...).

 

Anyway.

[Lord Liaden]

5 hours ago, Pariah said:

St. Louis Couple Who Brandished Guns At Black Protesters To Speak At RNC

 

That the convention organizers think this is a good idea, speaks volumes about them and about their opinion of Republicans in general.

[Badger]

You might be surprised. From what I have gathered they looked idiots with gun safety. But the fact, a lot of people were disturbed by the fact the incident was necessary in the first.  I feel the protests are going to hurt the Dems, at least in the fact they have avoided the issue of the more unsavory things that happened. I think they were actually making some headway with gun control among the public....

 

...then defund the police happened.