Political Discussion Thread (With Rules)

[Ragitsu]

8 minutes ago, Lord Liaden said:

 

I keep reading/hearing that about Dr. Fauci, but from my experience of his conferences it's exaggerated at worst. Fauci tries very hard to give honest, measured responses to questions, but since they usually take up more than one sound bite parts of them keep getting taken out of context and sensationalized. For example, I read a comment on YouTube just today: "Dr Fauci told us on Feb 29 that there was no reason not to go to malls or movie theaters. Stupid."

Here is a link to the actual interview from that date on NBC's "Today" show. To quote Dr. Fauci: "Right now, at this moment, there is no need to change anything you're doing on a day-by-day basis. Right now the risk is still low, but this could change. I've said that many times, even on this program. You've got to watch out, because although the risk is low now, you don't need to change anything you're doing, you start to see community spread, this could change, and force you to become much more attentive to doing things that would protect you from spread."

 

Quote-mining is a scourge on humanity.

[Badger]

3 hours ago, Ragitsu said:

 

If I had a second full-time job which, instead of aligning with my area of expertise, involved informing/placating Donald Trump, I imagine that I would eventually become acquainted with the taste of toe jam.

 

Yeah, I meant to include Trump in my post.  Between that a news conferences, he does end up between that proverbial rock and hard place.

[Badger]

3 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

 

I keep reading/hearing that about Dr. Fauci, but from my experience of his conferences it's exaggerated at worst. Fauci tries very hard to give honest, measured responses to questions, but since they usually take up more than one sound bite parts of them keep getting taken out of context and sensationalized. For example, I read a comment on YouTube just today: "Dr Fauci told us on Feb 29 that there was no reason not to go to malls or movie theaters. Stupid."

Here is a link to the actual interview from that date on NBC's "Today" show. To quote Dr. Fauci: "Right now, at this moment, there is no need to change anything you're doing on a day-by-day basis. Right now the risk is still low, but this could change. I've said that many times, even on this program. You've got to watch out, because although the risk is low now, you don't need to change anything you're doing, you start to see community spread, this could change, and force you to become much more attentive to doing things that would protect you from spread."

 

Yeah, I don't disagree, at least some/most probably are taken out of context.  But, regardless, I give him benefit of doubt under circumstances, so it kind of is immaterial for my own purposes. He is having to deal with 2 forces, that I can say I am not a fan of on a good day. 

[Badger]

2 hours ago, Ragitsu said:

 

Quote-mining is a scourge on humanity.

 

Seconded for the vote.

[Pariah]

The concept of Communism may have been the brainchild of Karl Marx, but the execution looked more like Groucho Marx.

[TrickstaPriest]

I think, one of the things that struck me about descriptions of the 'great leap forward' was that there was an unquestionable authority figure that everyone in the hierarchy was doing everything in their power to please.  He held so much power that no one could argue, complain, or disagree, and that desperation to compete to please him led the 'middle management' to essentially, compete to work their serfs to death.

 

Though it's been a loooong time since any of this has been described.  It's these mechanisms, not the overall political theory, that tend to attract my attention.

 

But of course, overall political theory shapes those mechanisms...

 

[Ternaugh]

 

[DShomshak]

16 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

 

I keep reading/hearing that about Dr. Fauci, but from my experience of his conferences it's exaggerated at worst. Fauci tries very hard to give honest, measured responses to questions, but since they usually take up more than one sound bite parts of them keep getting taken out of context and sensationalized. For example, I read a comment on YouTube just today: "Dr Fauci told us on Feb 29 that there was no reason not to go to malls or movie theaters. Stupid."

Here is a link to the actual interview from that date on NBC's "Today" show. To quote Dr. Fauci: "Right now, at this moment, there is no need to change anything you're doing on a day-by-day basis. Right now the risk is still low, but this could change. I've said that many times, even on this program. You've got to watch out, because although the risk is low now, you don't need to change anything you're doing, you start to see community spread, this could change, and force you to become much more attentive to doing things that would protect you from spread."

 

I am reminded of an editorial cartoon that made this trenchantly. The scene: Scientist at a podium announces that examination of a meteorite gave evidence consistent with the remote possibility that life may have once existed on Mars. Pack of reporters screams in unison, "There's life on Mars!"

 

Dean Shomshak

[Ragitsu]

I want to reemphasize how devastating it is to hear a family member speak when some profit-driven right-wing "news" source has already gotten to them. Basically, I attempted to explain that there are side effects of surviving the virus (or at least likely if not guaranteed side effects). "Bullshit" is what I was told and then the person started ranting about Bill Gates. Even though I stated that I hadn't mentioned Bill Gates and did not have Bill Gates on the brain, they remained a hungry dog latching onto a bone.

[Lord Liaden]

IME that kind of knee-jerk angry reaction generally has little to do with the person's actual feelings for the subject. There's something much deeper that's upsetting them, usually something very personal, which they can't or won't acknowledge. The subject is just a convenient target to let their anger out on, so they won't have to face the real issue.

[Old Man]

In case you were wondering where all the small business payroll money went

[Ranxerox]

A Biden Presidency Could Be Better Than Progressives Think

[Matt the Bruins]

10 hours ago, Old Man said:

In case you were wondering where all the small business payroll money went

That amounts to less than 0.10% of the total payroll relief amount designated, though. The individual anecdotes are worthy of ire, but if more than 99% of stimulus money goes where it's actually supposed to I'm prepared to declare the measure an amazing example of government efficiency. I've been bracing myself to hear about a "printing mistake" that puts Trump's signature on the Pay to the Order of line of a few million stimulus checks.

[Old Man]

Just now, Matt the Bruins said:

That amounts to less than 0.10% of the total payroll relief amount designated, though. The individual anecdotes are worthy of ire, but if more than 99% of stimulus money goes where it's actually supposed to I'm prepared to declare the measure an amazing example of government efficiency. I've been bracing myself to hear about a "printing mistake" that puts Trump's signature on the Pay to the Order of line of a few million stimulus checks.

 

I assumed that was where the "wrong bank account" stimulus deposits were going.

[Old Man]

The effect of Fox News on coronavirus transmission

 

Survey participants who preferred watching Carlson began changing their behavior on average three days earlier than other Fox News viewers. Meanwhile, participants who preferred Hannity acted much later—five days after other Fox News viewers, and eight days after Carlson viewers.

 

 

[Hermit]

33 minutes ago, Ranxerox said:

A Biden Presidency Could Be Better Than Progressives Think

 

Thanks for sharing that. It gives me a bit of hope.

 

 

[Ragitsu]

When are we going to entertain the notion that, oh, I don't know, the Constitution is not a holy text forever immune to criticism and...*gasp*...revision?

[Matt the Bruins]

To revise it you'd have to have an overwhelming majority agree to the revisions, which seems unlikely in the current political climate.

 

To be honest, as a Lefty Pinko I don't really need much reassurance about Biden even if he falls short of my own ideals in that direction. I will happily take "like Obama's, but less inspiring" in an administration as opposed to "four more years of dumpster fire."

[Lord Liaden]

Now there's a slogan for a campaign poster.

[Badger]

4 hours ago, Matt the Bruins said:

To revise it you'd have to have an overwhelming majority agree to the revisions, which seems unlikely in the current political climate.

 

To be honest, as a Lefty Pinko I don't really need much reassurance about Biden even if he falls short of my own ideals in that direction. I will happily take "like Obama's, but less inspiring" in an administration as opposed to "four more years of dumpster fire."

 

Yeah, but the worry for me is one dumpster fire for another.

[Dr. MID-Nite]

9 hours ago, Matt the Bruins said:

To revise it you'd have to have an overwhelming majority agree to the revisions, which seems unlikely in the current political climate.

 

To be honest, as a Lefty Pinko I don't really need much reassurance about Biden even if he falls short of my own ideals in that direction. I will happily take "like Obama's, but less inspiring" in an administration as opposed to "four more years of dumpster fire."

 

I for one don't think we should have to settle for "just don't completely suck" when it comes to people leading the damn country, but that's just me...

[Grailknight]

6 hours ago, Badger said:

 

Yeah, but the worry for me is one dumpster fire for another.

 

18 minutes ago, Dr. MID-Nite said:

 

I for one don't think we should have to settle for "just don't completely suck" when it comes to people leading the damn country, but that's just me...

 

Unfortunately, we are in the midst of one proven dumpster fire that keeps adding flammables by the hour. People wanted change from the "politics as usual" and Trump is the result.

 

Even if Biden can only do one thing like Obama, such as not having a single member of his administration or campaign  "sent to prison,  it would be a huge improvement. I refuse to settle for this current situation and give no respect or sympathy to those that cry "it Might be worse". Failing to take the least bad option is just plain failing whether by choice or abstention.

[Ragitsu]

I, for one, am sick of choosing between the lesser of two evils and allowing politicians to have my vote by default.

[Joe Walsh]

I'm struggling with this election as well

 

On the one hand, I've been voting for the lesser of two evils since 1988, and things have just gotten worse and worse. In each election we're told that next time we'll have a better choice, but right now, we have to choose one of these two, so choose the lesser evil. But the next time it's always the same story. Every time someone even mildly progressive starts to gain traction in the presidential race, the party elites and media unite to put and end to their campaign.

 

On the other hand, the evidence suggests Trump could be an existential threat to American democracy. One that our sociopolitical system seems unable to deal with. Do I want us to end up like Hungary or Russia? Absolutely not. Coming back from that costs blood, not votes...and may not be possible with today's surveillance technology.

 

I'll be voting for down-ballot progressives where possible (and giving what I can to down-ballot progressives in other districts). I know the weight of the party will be against them in every case, but sometimes it works. And that gives me hope.

 

And I suppose I will reluctantly vote for Biden. But goddamn, I can't help but feel that's part of the problem. Every time we vote for the lesser of two evils, we move the center further right. Voting for the lesser of two evils made Trump's rise possible. What was crazy right-wing stuff when I was a kid is now mainstream. And it's partly my fault.

[Ragitsu]

I don't know when exactly, but...the various educational institutions in my nation were fractured long ago. Now, combine that systemic kneecapping of education with certain portions of this land where the people vehemently insist their ignorance is equal to my knowledge (a belief they spread to their children, to the horror of any sane onlooker) and the end result is a climate where the wolves are free to terribly disguise themselves as shepherds and lead everyone to the slaughter. It takes an already intelligent and curious individual to self-educate when their school fails them; unfortunately, they are a minority which is easily shouted down by the howling masses. Finally, working within the current political structure is utter futility, because those that enter into it either become corrupted, compromise endlessly (arguably to the point of impotence) or burn out and quit in short order.

 

Revolution is nearly impossible for any number of reasons. Perhaps, much like the current pandemic, we've passed the point of no return and simply have to cling to mitigation until a miracle comes along.