Marvel Cinematic Universe, Phase Three and BEYOOOOONND

[Spence]

1 hour ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

 

So like NoMan from T.H.U.N.D.E.R. Agents, then.

 

Phase 4 doesn't fill me with excitement or even interest, I wonder if I am just getting burnt out on comic book movies or its just the characters are like the 4th string meh because they burnt up all their good franchises?

 

I know what you mean.  A lot of the comic content is being based on versions from the years I never read.  When the "hero" part was removed in favor of murderhobo and arrogant lectures I stopped buying.  The first round of MCU movies made me think they were back to heroes, but then they began shifting.  The news about Dr. Strange being dropped from WandaVision for bluntly PC BS really lowers my expectations.  Looks like the strength of just telling a good story is going to be buried under the check box garbage.

 

[Christopher R Taylor]

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who doesn't love Shang Chi. kung fu

 

I like Shang Chi okay and the first Dr Strange movie was pretty good but I don't really care if I see another.  I don't relaly consider Black Panther and Guardians of the Galaxy or Ant Man to be Marvel's A team. More like... the guys who fill in when the B team is busy.

[Tjack]

On 4/23/2021 at 12:57 PM, Logan.1179 said:

 

    Patton Oswalt as MODOK and Nathan Fillion as Wonder Man!    Wah-Hooooo!

[Spence]

On 4/23/2021 at 9:57 AM, Logan.1179 said:

 

Feels kinda like when printed comics died in the early 90s.

Now they are destroying TV versions.

[Lord Liaden]

12 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

 

I like Shang Chi okay and the first Dr Strange movie was pretty good but I don't really care if I see another.  I don't relaly consider Black Panther and Guardians of the Galaxy or Ant Man to be Marvel's A team. More like... the guys who fill in when the B team is busy.

 

Even many comics fans weren't aware of the present-day lineup of the Guardians of the Galaxy before their first movie, including me. Now they're cinematic superstars. It's all in how the character adaptations are executed.

 

Dr. Strange and Black Panther go back to Marvel Comics' early years, and are deeply woven into the continuity of that universe. They are as A team as Iron Man was before RDJ put on the armor. Marvel still has Spider-Man, Thor, and Hulk, who are most emphatically A team. Scarlet Witch and Vision are still in the mix. Sam Wilson, another veteran character, is now MCU's Captain America. Plus Marvel Films now has access to all the X-Men and Fantastic Four-related heroes and villains. To me it looks like the possibilities for the MCU are vast, with plenty of "name" characters to work with.

[Spence]

1 hour ago, Lord Liaden said:

Fantastic Four-related

This fills me with dread.......

[Iuz the Evil]

Winter falcon or whatever that was bored me to tears.

Spoiler

 

I liked Zemo, but for crying out loud they broke him out?! Zemo? 

 

Doctor Doom, the Red Skull, and the Mad Thinker weren’t available?

 

 

 Other than that, it was kind of tame. Some semi entertaining action scenes, but not that memorable.

 

I’ll probably pass on the sequel, it’s just not as cool without Chris Evans. I’ll likely feel the same about whatever they do re: Iron Man. Would rather they move on to new characters, cleaner break. Same problem with Black Panther.

 

 WandaVision was cool, very different. Would’ve been cooler with Dr. Strange in it, but it was a weird, fun time. 
 

Looking forward to Loki 

 

 

[Christopher R Taylor]

Loki might be okay just because Hiddleston is so talented.  As for the rest... meh.  No argument is going to make me care any more because its gut level.  I just am not excited at any level by any of the new stuff coming out.  Maybe its burnout, maybe its just the last few movies were marketed and pushed in a way that didn't exactly appeal to me.

[archer]

5 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

 

Phase 4 doesn't fill me with excitement or even interest, I wonder if I am just getting burnt out on comic book movies or its just the characters are like the 4th string meh because they burnt up all their good franchises?

 

For me it isn't that they burned up their good franchises but that their best franchises aren't part of Phase 4 but will be Phase 5 or later: X-Men and the Fantastic Four.

 

I want to see what Feige does with the FF. They're explorers as much as heroes so they can help fill out a lot of the unexplored portions of the comic book universe.

 

In the comic books, the Thing does a lot of guest appearances. SFX expense probably wouldn't allow for that. But they could easily have Reed Richards be the superhero tech consultant in any movie. Or have heroes drop by the Baxter Building looking for assistance only to find that no one is home.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Yeah with Stark out of the way, who they turned into the ultimate god of all science and technology (instead of Reed Richards) there's room for Reed.  Of course he's going to seem like a Stark knockoff now.

 

I am kind of looking forward to a good treatment of the FF, but I am always skeptical what we get these days.  Well done the FF would be amazing.  But we've seen 3 ghastly attempts so far.

[Greywind]

27 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

Yeah with Stark out of the way, who they turned into the ultimate god of all science and technology (instead of Reed Richards) there's room for Reed.  Of course he's going to seem like a Stark knockoff now.

 

I am kind of looking forward to a good treatment of the FF, but I am always skeptical what we get these days.  Well done the FF would be amazing.  But we've seen 3 ghastly attempts so far.

 

But that was supposed to be Peter's new niche.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Potentially the kid sister of Black Panther too, who is apparently the science goddess who knows all but they never use her as a resource

[archer]

2 minutes ago, Greywind said:

 

But that was supposed to be Peter's new niche.

 

They're not going to move Peter through high school and college fast enough for him to learn to be a world-class tech/science guru.

 

Does this list of skills sound like Peter:

 

Computer Programming

Criminology

Cryptography

Demolitions

Electronics

Forensic Medicine

Inventor

Mechanics

Navigation

Security Systems

Systems Operation

Weaponsmith

 

Plus this (partial) list of sciences:

 

Aeronautics

Architecture

Astronomy

Astrophysics

Biophysics

Chemistry

Computer Design

Cybernetics

Dimensional Physics

Electronics Engineering

Exobiology

Genetics

High Energy Physics

Mathematics

Mechanical Engineering

Metallurgy

Physics

Subatomic Physics

Robotics

Vehicle Engineering

 

Plus enough Wealth to be able to casually build the things he dreams up, and perhaps give those things away, without having to worry about the expense.

 

That's what Reed brings to the table but which Peter, for the most part, doesn't.

 

2 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

Potentially the kid sister of Black Panther too, who is apparently the science goddess who knows all but they never use her as a resource

 

Well, she disappeared in the Snap. Prior to that, she lived on another continent, in an obscure country, in a city which was hidden behind an energy shield, and was overprotected by a smothering older brother.  

[Christopher R Taylor]

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Plus enough Wealth to be able to casually build the things he dreams up, and perhaps give those things away, without having to worry about the expense.

 

Which is the problem with how they built up Stark.  He was never, ever the top end guy in the marvel brain trust.  Damn smart with amazing armory and weapon skills, but nothing compared to Reed.  But since they made Stark into That Guy, now Reed makes no sense.  Where was he all this time?  How could he suddenly just appear?  I mean in the comics they do it all the time but the movies people will throw a fit if he's suddenly smart as Stark but never was seen before.

 

FF would have to be a dimensional jump or something, came from another world, and in the process got their superpowers.

[Old Man]

1 hour ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

FF would have to be a dimensional jump or something, came from another world, and in the process got their superpowers.

 

I'd actually like to see FF in an episodic TV format.  It is the quintessential family-that-happens-to-have-superpowers concept, and that really lends itself to situational dramedy.  Plus, directors won't be able to blow $200M on effects if they aren't given $200M.  (It would need more money than they gave the CW shows though.)

[Bazza]

So it would be like No Ordinary Family, but better & in the MCU, and on D+. 

[Christopher R Taylor]

FF is family but they're first and foremost explorers of the unknown, adventurers like Star Trek, Johnny Quest, Doc Savage, Lost In Space, etc.  I'd love for them to focus more heavily on that.

Even having them show up from the 1960s, if possible, a real throwback to a different era and outlook.

[Grailknight]

2 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

 

Which is the problem with how they built up Stark.  He was never, ever the top end guy in the marvel brain trust.  Damn smart with amazing armory and weapon skills, but nothing compared to Reed.  But since they made Stark into That Guy, now Reed makes no sense.  Where was he all this time?  How could he suddenly just appear?  I mean in the comics they do it all the time but the movies people will throw a fit if he's suddenly smart as Stark but never was seen before.

 

FF would have to be a dimensional jump or something, came from another world, and in the process got their superpowers.

 

That's an artifact of the FF not being an MCU property from the beginning more than a writing flaw.  Pym and Banner were there to be used but they chose to put it all on Stark. Just introduce Reed as a super scientist. He doesn't have to explained any more than the rest of the FF do when their movie hits. From then on he can become the go to science guy unless they focus more on Shuri.  

[Spence]

11 hours ago, Old Man said:

 

I'd actually like to see FF in an episodic TV format.  It is the quintessential family-that-happens-to-have-superpowers concept, and that really lends itself to situational dramedy.  Plus, directors won't be able to blow $200M on effects if they aren't given $200M.  (It would need more money than they gave the CW shows though.)

 

11 hours ago, Bazza said:

So it would be like No Ordinary Family, but better & in the MCU, and on D+. 

 

11 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

FF is family but they're first and foremost explorers of the unknown, adventurers like Star Trek, Johnny Quest, Doc Savage, Lost In Space, etc.  I'd love for them to focus more heavily on that.

Even having them show up from the 1960s, if possible, a real throwback to a different era and outlook.

 

This would be fantastic and audiences would love it.

 

But then Hollywood would happen.

[Bazza]

 

[Lord Liaden]

On 5/4/2021 at 4:58 PM, Iuz the Evil said:

Winter falcon or whatever that was bored me to tears.

  Hide contents

 

I liked Zemo, but for crying out loud they broke him out?! Zemo? 

 

Doctor Doom, the Red Skull, and the Mad Thinker weren’t available?

 

 

MCU Red Skull is literally unavailable, being a damned soul on an alien planet. Zemo had a lot of knowledge about Hydra's super-soldier serum and program, as well as the world of international espionage, which is what Sam and Bucky needed. His history with Bucky made for an interesting character interaction.

 

I don't know why it still surprises me how individuals can have such radically different reactions to the same entertainment.

[L. Marcus]

"We're all individuals!"

 

"I'm not."

[Bazza]

2 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

I don't know why it still surprises me how individuals can have such radically different reactions to the same entertainment.

I’m mostly not, anymore. People in the Occident fall mostly into two worldviews: those who assert the existence of intellectual reality, and those who deny it. 

[slikmar]

10 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

 

MCU Red Skull is literally unavailable, being a damned soul on an alien planet. Zemo had a lot of knowledge about Hydra's super-soldier serum and program, as well as the world of international espionage, which is what Sam and Bucky needed. His history with Bucky made for an interesting character interaction.

 

I don't know why it still surprises me how individuals can have such radically different reactions to the same entertainment.

Not to mention that Doom is FF based and known for that, even before the movies ruined him. Zemo is, in the comics world, a long time enemy of Cap. Why wouldn't you use what was already developed. Granted, I had no chance to see the series, but would be great if they used the series (though given most series predilection for killing villains, unlikely) to setup the Masters of Evil.

[Christopher R Taylor]

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The best heroes are going to be back with the Guardians and Ant-man/Wasp. 

 

I guess we disagree on who are the "best" or even "heroes"