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I'm reading that there were shootings at two mosques, a few miles apart? Did that mean more than one shooter? Because that would be very unusual.

 

Glad they neutralized the IEDs. I've noticed these spree shootings often come with IEDs, but they almost never go off.

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18 hours ago, Michael Hopcroft said:

The beliefs that drive things like that are inhuman, and I agree with Old Man that this-- this monster

 

I fully understand and appreciate why someone wouldn't want to be associated with someone like the shooter. However, I wonder if it's really a good idea to give in to the impulse to pretend that such people are other than human, or somehow qualitatively different from us. If we forget that "people like us" have the capacity to commit atrocities, we run the risk of failing to carefully consider the ethics of our own actions, ceasing to police ourselves because we know we're not "one of those people."

 

I strongly suspect that such thinking is a part of the mix that produces these atrocities.

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On 3/13/2019 at 8:33 PM, Old Man said:

An unfortunate sequence of events:

  1. Customers request that Boeing produce an updated version of the 737.
  2. Boeing cannot alter the wings or airframe of the 737 because that would create an entirely new type that would have to undergo lengthy FAA approval procedures.  Instead, it adds more powerful engines.
  3. The engines must be mounted higher and more forward of the wings.  This alters the aircraft's center of gravity.  In addition, at high angles of attack, the engine nacelles generate additional lift forward of the wings.
  4. Boeing corrects for the resulting instability by adding a system called MCAS, which is designed to automatically force the nose down if AOA (angle of attack) sensors indicate that the aircraft is approaching aerodynamic stall. 
  5. Boeing sort of fails to emphasize to airlines and pilots the importance of MCAS and of knowing how to turn it off. 
  6. AOA sensors fail.  MCAS forces the nose down.  Pilots don't know how to turn off MCAS.  Aircraft trajectories intersect with the surface of the Earth. 

 

Oh god, I feel remembered of both the Starfighter and Ariane 5 Disasters.

And both were horrible mistakes. If this cause is true, it ranges somewhere in the middle between the Starfighter Affair (116 avoidable dead Pilots over decades) and the Arian 5 (only Commercial loss).

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On 3/14/2019 at 6:12 PM, Hermit said:

The colleges are claiming to be victims too because this makes them look bad when it was actually one or two members of the faculty in each and a few coaches that were really in on it. While I agree that the universities are not all in on it, it's a bad read of the room for them to claim 'victimhood' here when the real losers are the kids who got bumped by affluenza laden scams like this.  If the colleges want to instill some good will? How about hunt down those that might have been cheated and see if they want a highly discounted ride if they're still looking. 

They had a Duty to make sure that did not happen. They failed that duty. Claiming Victimhood is not making them sound as if they take it seriously.

 

On 3/14/2019 at 8:29 PM, Bazza said:

My secret is out? Or is it? 

With Quantum anything you can never be sure :)

 

20 hours ago, Hermit said:

About 3 miles apart according to this

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/49-killed-in-terrorist-attack-at-mosques-in-christchurch-new-zealand/ar-BBUNdQG?ocid=spartanntp

 

I am gratified they are calling these terrorists TERRORISTS. 

That has become a real issue in the last years.

 

4 hours ago, Zeropoint said:

 

I fully understand and appreciate why someone wouldn't want to be associated with someone like the shooter. However, I wonder if it's really a good idea to give in to the impulse to pretend that such people are other than human, or somehow qualitatively different from us. If we forget that "people like us" have the capacity to commit atrocities, we run the risk of failing to carefully consider the ethics of our own actions, ceasing to police ourselves because we know we're not "one of those people."

 

I strongly suspect that such thinking is a part of the mix that produces these atrocities.

I agree. If anything, this is too human.

 

I am a german that does not deny the holocaust happened in my Country. So no cruelty of mankind surprises me.

Of course they do still disgust me.

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11 hours ago, Zeropoint said:

 

I fully understand and appreciate why someone wouldn't want to be associated with someone like the shooter. However, I wonder if it's really a good idea to give in to the impulse to pretend that such people are other than human, or somehow qualitatively different from us. If we forget that "people like us" have the capacity to commit atrocities, we run the risk of failing to carefully consider the ethics of our own actions, ceasing to police ourselves because we know we're not "one of those people."

 

I strongly suspect that such thinking is a part of the mix that produces these atrocities.

I see and respect your point about the knee-jerk reaction. I don't want to believe I personally am capable of a deed like this. It is fortunate that most people are not. 

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13 hours ago, Zeropoint said:

However, I wonder if it's really a good idea to give in to the impulse to pretend that such people are other than human, or somehow qualitatively different from us. If we forget that "people like us" have the capacity to commit atrocities, we run the risk of failing to carefully consider the ethics of our own actions, ceasing to police ourselves because we know we're not "one of those people."

 

I don't think this is an "it can happen to anyone" type of situation. It's more of an "it can happen to lots of people." So, yeah, they're pretty human. Part of the problem in this case that not only were this group acting very much in line with human behavior, but that they were swayed by rhetoric that's become too common. Those who act out violently are in the minority, and it will doubtless happen again. But make no mistake, they aren't "people like us." At least not people like me. I don't have to deny their humanity to also deny that I'm not going to blame an entire race, creed or religion for my problems, nor to recognize that I won't ever kill indiscriminately for any reason. I can comfortably say that these people are in fact qualitatively different from me (and likely most of the board here, or at least I hope so) and that they're doing very human things at the same time. Yes, everyone is subject to some level of groupthink and to certain human tendencies, but not everyone is a piece of crap who would murder innocents. Most of us can control our baser instincts to a better degree than that.

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Though, it does seem political issues are more likely to cause such feelings that lead to such.  And disturbingly too often the person with such feelings, don't seem to truly realize what they are becoming.   

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As a further illustration of just how completely our news media universe has collapsed, I found out this morning from a blog (so, you know, hurrah for Balloon Juice) that Nebraska is under water. While I expect no better of the Huffington Post, it didn't make Slate or Vox; or, more seriously, the CBC radio national news. 

It all makes me a little sick, since there's a developing trend in social media for people to claim that everyone's ignoring the situation in Nebraska because they're a bunch of "deplorables."Just what we needed this weekend.

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Let's just say, when Katrina hit New Orleans, and watching the coverage of that, the thought did occur to me that in my area we wouldnt be so lucky.  And we would all become extras in Mad Max 5.

 

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, Christopher said:

"Sometimes the only way to survive, is to give up all concern for your safety" - Tzun Tsu.

 

And it is a bit scary that the "Art of War" applies to surving in New Zealand.

 

Unfortunately, there were other heroes who weren't so lucky.

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11 hours ago, Lawnmower Boy said:

As a further illustration of just how completely our news media universe has collapsed, I found out this morning from a blog (so, you know, hurrah for Balloon Juice) that Nebraska is under water. While I expect no better of the Huffington Post, it didn't make Slate or Vox; or, more seriously, the CBC radio national news. 

It all makes me a little sick, since there's a developing trend in social media for people to claim that everyone's ignoring the situation in Nebraska because they're a bunch of "deplorables."Just what we needed this weekend.

 

It may not be that Nebraska is peopled with 'deplorables'; it may just be that Nebraska's 5 electoral votes aren't going to swing the next election.

 

That's not really better, is it?

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On 3/16/2019 at 8:17 AM, Zeropoint said:

 

I fully understand and appreciate why someone wouldn't want to be associated with someone like the shooter. However, I wonder if it's really a good idea to give in to the impulse to pretend that such people are other than human, or somehow qualitatively different from us. If we forget that "people like us" have the capacity to commit atrocities, we run the risk of failing to carefully consider the ethics of our own actions, ceasing to police ourselves because we know we're not "one of those people."

 

I strongly suspect that such thinking is a part of the mix that produces these atrocities.

Totally agree. 

Also demonising the individual gives people the idea that this person should have been easy to detect and prevent. The cynic in me thinks it's so politicians can make some quick law change and say "job done"  rather than invest in the harder job of mental health services needed to find these people. 

 

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20 hours ago, Lawnmower Boy said:

As a further illustration of just how completely our news media universe has collapsed, I found out this morning from a blog (so, you know, hurrah for Balloon Juice) that Nebraska is under water. While I expect no better of the Huffington Post, it didn't make Slate or Vox; or, more seriously, the CBC radio national news. 

It all makes me a little sick, since there's a developing trend in social media for people to claim that everyone's ignoring the situation in Nebraska because they're a bunch of "deplorables."Just what we needed this weekend.

For Profit TV News was just stupid idea. Let us finally realize that, and find a replacement. Anything that does not require Political groups or Ad revenue for Financing.

 

I can only point you to the german solution after WW2. It is a bit pricy due to decentralization and needing it's own revenue aparatus, but really it is dang hard to manipulate by anyone.

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I was reminded today just how big the world is.  In December, an asteroid came down over the Bering Sea and ended in a fireball bigger than some nukes. And we're only just now noticing. An explosion like that on earth, and nobody even noticed. The Earth is just that big.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/us-detects-huge-meteor-explosion/ar-BBUTWHb

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